Discover says "up to date" but Muon/APT has upgradable packages

[Thwompin]

I was checking out Muon for installing software and noticed it says 23 packages are upgradable, even though Discover doesn't have any updates available. Why? Is it recommended I upgrade or do I leave it alone and only update through Discovery?
"apt list --upgradable" gives me


bluedevil/jammy-updates 4:5.24.6-0ubuntu0.1 amd64 [upgradable from: 4:5.24.4-0ubuntu1]
breeze-cursor-theme/jammy-updates,jammy-updates 4:5.24.6-0ubuntu0.1 all [upgradable from: 4:5.24.4-0ubuntu1]
breeze/jammy-updates 4:5.24.6-0ubuntu0.1 amd64 [upgradable from: 4:5.24.4-0ubuntu1]
kde-config-sddm/jammy-updates 4:5.24.6-0ubuntu0.1 amd64 [upgradable from: 4:5.24.4-0ubuntu1]
kde-config-updates/jammy-updates 5.24.6-0ubuntu0.1 amd64 [upgradable from: 5.24.4-0ubuntu1]
kde-style-breeze/jammy-updates 4:5.24.6-0ubuntu0.1 amd64 [upgradable from: 4:5.24.4-0ubuntu1]
kde-style-oxygen-qt5/jammy-updates 4:5.24.6-0ubuntu0.1 amd64 [upgradable from: 4:5.24.4-0ubuntu1]
kinfocenter/jammy-updates 4:5.24.6-0ubuntu0.1 amd64 [upgradable from: 4:5.24.4-0ubuntu1]
kscreen/jammy-updates 4:5.24.6-0ubuntu0.1 amd64 [upgradable from: 4:5.24.4-0ubuntu1]
ksystemstats/jammy-updates 5.24.6-0ubuntu0.1 amd64 [upgradable from: 5.24.4-0ubuntu1]
kwin-style-breeze/jammy-updates 4:5.24.6-0ubuntu0.1 amd64 [upgradable from: 4:5.24.4-0ubuntu1]
liboxygenstyle5-5/jammy-updates 4:5.24.6-0ubuntu0.1 amd64 [upgradable from: 4:5.24.4-0ubuntu1]
liboxygenstyleconfig5-5/jammy-updates 4:5.24.6-0ubuntu0.1 amd64 [upgradable from: 4:5.24.4-0ubuntu1]
milou/jammy-updates 4:5.24.6-0ubuntu0.1 amd64 [upgradable from: 4:5.24.4-0ubuntu1]
oxygen-sounds/jammy-updates,jammy-updates 4:5.24.6-0ubuntu0.1 all [upgradable from: 4:5.24.4-0ubuntu1]
plasma-discover-backend-fwupd/jammy-updates 5.24.6-0ubuntu0.1 amd64 [upgradable from: 5.24.4-0ubuntu1]
plasma-discover-backend-snap/jammy-updates 5.24.6-0ubuntu0.1 amd64 [upgradable from: 5.24.4-0ubuntu1]
plasma-discover-common/jammy-updates,jammy-updates 5.24.6-0ubuntu0.1 all [upgradable from: 5.24.4-0ubuntu1]
plasma-discover/jammy-updates 5.24.6-0ubuntu0.1 amd64 [upgradable from: 5.24.4-0ubuntu1]
plasma-nm/jammy-updates 4:5.24.5-0ubuntu0.1 amd64 [upgradable from: 4:5.24.4-0ubuntu1]
qml-module-org-kde-ksysguard/jammy-updates 4:5.24.6-0ubuntu0.1 amd64 [upgradable from: 4:5.24.4-0ubuntu1]
sddm-theme-breeze/jammy-updates 4:5.24.6-0ubuntu0.1 amd64 [upgradable from: 4:5.24.4-0ubuntu1]
systemsettings/jammy-updates 4:5.24.6-0ubuntu0.1 amd64 [upgradable from: 4:5.24.4-0ubuntu1]

[jlittle]

Welcome to the confusion (IMO) of APT phased updates, amplified by a lot of plasma being updated. Let's pick one of those, with my emphasis:

$ apt-cache policy systemsettings
systemsettings:
Installed: 4:5.24.4-0ubuntu1
Candidate: 4:5.24.6-0ubuntu0.1
Version table:
4:5.24.6-0ubuntu0.1 500] *******(phased 30%)********
500 http://nz.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu jammy-updates/universe amd64 Packages
*** 4:5.24.4-0ubuntu1 500
500 http://nz.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu jammy/universe amd64 Packages
100 /var/lib/dpkg/status​

This means the update is being "phased" over a period, maybe a week, being rolled out gradually. I'm not sure exactly what 30% means, but I guess it's that 30% of users have received the update. I gather the idea is to be able to limit the damage of a bad update.

They've existed for a while, but I don't know why they've just hit us so hard. ask ubuntu has a number of answers about it. There's APT settings to adjust the behaviour, but I can't offer any advice about them.

[Snowhog]

Us 'seasoned' users would/will advise doing all package maintenance from the command line, and use Discover (or better, IMO, Muon Package Manager) to search for packages. From the command line: sudo apt update && sudo apt full-upgrade Myself, I run this at least once a day.

[claydoh]

Muon and apt are showing them as upgradeable but are you actually able to upgrade them directly, without a bunch of work at least?

Yeah, phased updates do make sense dor SRU'd things on an LTS release, but of course make for a ton of confusions

here is a page that shows the currwent list of phased stuff, mainly Plasma related items at the moment
https://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu...d-updates.html
IMO this is a GOOD thing for Kubuntu in particular, in the long run. It gets these smaller updates from the backports PPA into the main repos a bit sooner, I think.

[dejjanku]

Even from the command line it says 39 packages can be upgraded, run apt list...
And then goes on without upgrading it.

[claydoh]

And then goes on without upgrading it.

Because they are being released in phases, some get it right away, others a bit later. This is to catch potential regressions before it gets out to *everyone*. Particularly useful on an LTS release.
it is a new feature fairly recently added to apt by its developers.

[jlittle]

Muon and apt are showing them as upgradeable but are you actually able to upgrade them directly, without a bunch of work at least?

One can run apt install on the packages and the upgrade will be applied. I'd been doing that to remove the annoyance, but I don't know how advisable it is. Presumably it marks the packages as manually installed. But with such a large update, I decided to be patient.

[Thwompin]

I see, so the upgradable packages gradually appear in Discovery so they can be applied there. That's fine by me.
Thank you all for clarifying.

[claydoh]

This can be turned off iirc via /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/99-phased-updates config edits, I think

https://discourse.ubuntu.com/t/phase...in-21-04/20345
^^^^
The usual crappy responses to completely inadequate documentation
and tb all it might take is to add some informational messaging to the output, or mask things to keep it from being so 'scary'

Then again, these Kubuntu related phased SRU updates are causing oddball things like the removal of the kubuntu-desktop meta-package for command line updaters who weren't paying attention, due to dependency silliness over the held packages.


Yay

[jlittle]

I decided to be patient.

Just after I posted that, the updates landed. All those plasma updates killed plasma; I suspect I should have done the upgrade using a Linux console. I used the console to reboot, and X didn't start. I ran startx and KDE seems to be ok.
[Edit] sddm was borked; something to do with the theme. sudo apt install --reinstall sddm has got it going, though it's not happy and quite ugly.