Was AntiVirus; Now something Completely Different!

[SteveRiley]

I was told once, that the only "true" way to protect ones data is to have it isolated from everything else.

A potential definition of a "secure" computer is one that has no applications, no operating system, is encased in solid concrete, and sunk to the bottom of the ocean! This same computer could also be defined as "useless." But even here, the computer and its concrete casing are vulnerable to corrosion from saltwater and destruction from the intense pressures on the ocean floor.

As Feathers astutely observes, one must always make trade-offs. You connect your computer to a network not because there exist risks but because there exists rewards -- rewards that, presumably, outweigh the risks. You can further alter the risk:reward ratio by taking appropriate steps to minimize the risk; these have the nicely coincidental benefit of likely helping to maximize the rewards as well.

In 2007, I delivered a talk at the various Microsoft TechEds around the world on exactly this topic: security trade-offs. It got some press coverage. Not all commenters on the various pieces expressed positive reactions. Nevertheless, I stand by my assertions. Security decisions always involve trade-offs. It doesn't matter whether you're trying to protect a computer from an attacker, an airplane from a jihadist, or a nation from its enemies -- the requirement to balance risks, threats, rewards, and access always applies. Those who argue otherwise do so from bias or emotion, not from rational assessment.

http://arstechnica.com/information-t...rity-overkill/
http://apcmag.com/too_much_security_..._microsoft.htm
http://blogs.msmvps.com/alunj/2007/0...ley-at-teched/ -- I agree with Alun's mild rejoinder
http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/...y-is-bad-thing
http://slashdot.org/story/07/08/08/1...r-is-overblown -- such a variety of reactions; most people get off the rails
http://www.crn.com.au/Tools/Print.aspx?CIID=24546

[vinnywright]

nice talk ,,,,,shame on them for censoring and removing some of it from the DVD's ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, O ya ,,,we cant have the truth out their .

VINNY

[SteveRiley]

Yeah. And to those who claim the Internet never forgets, Microsoft has somehow made my TechEd talks disappear. The various places where you could watch recordings from prior years are all just gone. Sigh.

[Feathers McGraw]

A potential definition of a "secure" computer is one that has no applications, no operating system, is encased in solid concrete, and sunk to the bottom of the ocean! This same computer could also be defined as "useless." But even here, the computer and its concrete casing are vulnerable to corrosion from saltwater and destruction from the intense pressures on the ocean floor.

Careful there Steve, you wouldn't want to start a conversation about concrete with a Civil Engineer!

[SteveRiley]

I used to live in Ohio, where applying salt to roads, sidewalks, and driveways to remove snow is a routine procedure. Such applications resulted in regular descrution of roads, sidewalks, and driveways. If you're saying that salinity and compression won't affect concrete, I say prove it

[Feathers McGraw]

If you're saying that salinity and compression won't affect concrete, I say prove it

I would have to be mad to make such a claim! Although most of those salts have a much greater effect on the rebar than the concrete itself (so mass concrete would do OK)... and I doubt you'd get crystallisation at the bottom of the ocean, so there goes one part of the problem!

In general, concrete loves a bit of compression, but that pumping action you get when vehicles drive over it doesn't help because it pushes the salt further inside.

Incidentally, one of the worst places you can put reinforced concrete is in the splash zone by the sea... much worse than permanently underwater because you get an unlimited supply of salt drawn up through capillary action, which crystallises under the surface and causes spalling (outer layers flaking/popping off).

Sulphates are also present in sea water and they would still cause problems though. They react with the cementitious compounds and turn them into other compounds that won't hold the concrete together, and have a much higher volume, leading to internal tensile forces. I did my dissertation on the effect of sulphates on mass concrete, but I'll spare you the details!

[SteveRiley]

spalling (outer layers flaking/popping off).

I'm going to have to incorporate this wonderful new word into my vocabulary. "Hey, Bob, your scalp is spalling!"

Sulphates are also present in sea water and they would still cause problems though. They react with the cementitious compounds and turn them into other compounds that won't hold the concrete together, and have a much higher volume, leading to internal tensile forces. I did my dissertation on the effect of sulphates on mass concrete, but I'll spare you the details!

Must have been a hard paper.

[Feathers McGraw]

Must have been a hard paper.

That was delightfully awful... hehe.

[oshunluvr]

I would have to be mad to make such a claim! Although most of those salts have a much greater effect on the rebar than the concrete itself (so mass concrete would do OK)... and I doubt you'd get crystallisation at the bottom of the ocean, so there goes one part of the problem!

In general, concrete loves a bit of compression, but that pumping action you get when vehicles drive over it doesn't help because it pushes the salt further inside.

Incidentally, one of the worst places you can put reinforced concrete is in the splash zone by the sea... much worse than permanently underwater because you get an unlimited supply of salt drawn up through capillary action, which crystallises under the surface and causes spalling (outer layers flaking/popping off).

Sulphates are also present in sea water and they would still cause problems though. They react with the cementitious compounds and turn them into other compounds that won't hold the concrete together, and have a much higher volume, leading to internal tensile forces. I did my dissertation on the effect of sulphates on mass concrete, but I'll spare you the details!

Well, aren't you a fount of unusual knowledge

[Feathers McGraw]

Well, aren't you a fount of unusual knowledge

Doesn't it just make you want to be a Civil Engineer? Lol

[oshunluvr]

Doesn't it just make you want to be a Civil Engineer? Lol

Well, think of the amazing and interesting conventions you folks must have...

[GerardV]

How on earth did we get from anti-virus to icy roads. I have seen some forks here, but this has to be the most unusual one!

[anonprivate]

When I started this thread I assumed that all posts would relate to Anti-Virus

I am amazed at the diversion.

[Qqmike]

Jeez, here I thought it was about
https://www.census.gov/svsd/www/vius/2002.html

[vinnywright]

When I started this thread I assumed that all posts would relate to Anti-Virus

I am amazed at the diversion.

LOL,,,,,,,,,,,,, new hear are ya .

I would say 70-80% of all threads around hear digress to TOT. {Totally Off Topic}

VINNY