Announcement

**oshunluvr** · Jan 17, 2011, 11:56 PM

Re: Future partitioning help

As far as partitioning information:

Each hard drive can hold 4 Primary partitions.
One of these Primary partitions may be an Extended partition.
An Extended partition can hold up to 63 Logical partitions.

Therefore, using a combination of the above partitions, you could have up to 66 addressable partitions on a single hard drive: 4 primary, minus 1 extended, plus 63 logical.

Using linux, one may install to and boot from any partition (except in the very rare case of a bios issue). Generally, Windows OS's must be in a Primary partition and begin within the first 1024 cylinders of the hard drive.

As far as the bootloader, you may at install time choose to install the kubuntu bootloader (grub-pc) to a partition rather than the hard drive master boot record, or even not install it at all. In you would prefer to use grub-pc to access the openSuse install, I would go ahead and let kubuntu install grub-pc. The latest editions of grub-pc have had no trouble detecting openSuse installs. If it fails to detect it, you can still manually enter it in the grub-pc menu by editing /etc/grub.d/40_custom

Once you're running properly, you can change grub-pc to default to the openSuse install and not display a boot menu at all. You can then display the menu manually by holding down the shift key during boot.

**Linkmaster** · Jan 18, 2011, 12:05 AM

Re: Future partitioning help

Thank you for explaining the partions to me! I had the idea correct, but the terminology wrong. Though I'm not looking to fragment my drive THAT much, haha.

And honestly, I have no intentions of using a Windows OS as my main partion anymore. I like Linux a whole lot more now that I've been using it.

So, if I have this right, I can override the windows files that will be sitting useless on my computer, then install Kubuntu onto it, and allow it to install the bootloader. Once doing that, I manually enter trhough /etc/grub.d/40_custom? Is this the file thats found on the Kubuntu Home, which are hidden unless I tell them not to be?

As well, if it helps, what happened last time I let regular ole Ubuntu take over, when I tried to load the openSUSE up, it simply gave me a black screen. It refused to load. Not sure what that means, or if it helps anything.

With the last bit, how do I configure the GRUB-PC to default to openSUSE? And would I be able to hold the shift key before I do anything to access the boot menu as well? Even if the other OS's[?] are "hidden" persay?

**vinnywright** · Jan 18, 2011, 01:29 AM

Re: Future partitioning help

Hay Linkmaster

could you please elaborate on this

My question/problem is that in the near and undetermined future, my computer will be taken for school purposes, and they will most likely have four partitions on the computer

and then this .........espeshaley the "allowed" part

Its going to have SUSE Linux[blah] as the main partition that I'm allowed to use, and the other three will be hidden/not accesable.

then when you say this

It is somehow set up to boot from the SUSE rather then GRUB.

do you know how it's booting? .......probably grub but straight to SUSE with out stopping at a menu...??
if thats the case you can have it boot whatever you put on the box.

What I am wanting to do is overwrite one of the partitions[a partition that contains Windows files]

what are the windows files for ...or used by?? ........or are they leftovers ?

What I'm afraid of what might happen is that when I install Kubuntu 10.10, it will overwrite the current bootloader from the SUSE, and use GRUB, but make SUSE not accessable[this happened the first time I tried it, but using Ubuntu Netbook Edition instead of Kubuntu].

that is highly likely as I don't think the 10.10 installer gives you the option NOT to install grub..........but you should still be able to add SUSE to the boot menu.

Once doing that, I manually enter trhough /etc/grub.d/40_custom? Is this the file thats found on the Kubuntu Home, which are hidden unless I tell them not to be?

close kinda .......... /etc/grub.d/40_custom is the file you eddit to add OS's to the boot menu manually if

Code:

sudo update-grub

dosent find it and add it automatically .......and is in /etc/grub.d ..not /home/username hidden files can be any ware and are hidden by the . at the beginning of the file name.
like somefile is not hidden but .somefile is

you should read up on this...... http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1195275 if you dont want to half to take the box back to the school's IT people with your head hanging low .......

VINNY

**oshunluvr** · Jan 18, 2011, 09:13 AM

Re: Future partitioning help

So, if I have this right, I can override the windows files that will be sitting useless on my computer

I'm not totally sure what you mean by this. I assume you're referring to the boot loader? Grub-pc will indeed over-write the MBR (Master Boot Record). FYI the MBR is only 512 byes long and really only points the boot loader to a boot file and/or program. It also contains the partition information.

As far as multi-booting, grub-pc should and will likely detect all your bootable partitions as long as they follow a format that grub-pc understands. I have had no issues with the current version(s) of grub-pc detecting my openSuse install.

In the unlikely event it doesn't detect it properly, you can then manually add a boot stanza to the 40_custom file.

To change the default on boot, you need to edit /etc/default/grub. The first line is

GRUB_DEFAULT=0

change it to reflect the line number you want to default to in your boot menu. Remember that it's geek counting so you start with Zero, not 1.

In the default setup, the grub-pc boot menu will likely have two stanzas per kernel for your main install, two stanzas for memtest, then two each for each additional linux install, one for any windows installs, and finally
anything you put in 40_custom. This is important to note, because if you add additional kernels (from updates) to a linux install, the boot menu will increase in size by two. If you remove a kernel it will decrease in size by two. Both instances changing the number of lines in your boot menu, thus possibly causing it to default to a different line. There's a way to "fix" this if need be.

I know this sounds complex, but it's really not. I can't address exactly what will happen in your case without more exact information on what you intend to do.

**Linkmaster** · Jan 18, 2011, 04:33 PM

Re: Future partitioning help

@vinnywright:

What I mean by allowed is that they will wipe my computer, place openSUSE on it, along with three other logical partitions that are "hidden"[since it is set to boot directly to openSUSE].
The Windows files are I believe to be installation files of some sort. I'm not sure, I will just be wanting them gone.
I looked at the link, and it is extremely helpful! And your right, I do NOT want to bring my box back to IT, haha. That would equal bad things[including a 25 dollar fine]

@oshunluvr

I realized that this quote was badly worded, let me try and say it better: There are Windows installation files[I believe] that will be sitting on the computer. I simply wish to erase them, put Kubuntu in the new free space, and then use GRUB to still access openSUSE.
My problem wasn't on detection[using the Ubuntu Netbook Edition]. It SAW the openSUSE just fine, but when I tried to boot it up, nothing would happen. It would turn to a black screen and just sit there. Not characters, nothing. Concerning what you said at the bottom, it doesn't sound all that complex, just frustrating, haha. I'm just worried that it won't be able to access the openSUSE. Like stated, I can detect it usually, but when I try to load it up, black screen.

I don't know if any of you are still confused by what I mean, but heres a quote from the [http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1195275] link that pretty much describes what happens:[Found in section 5]:

On computers on which Grub 2 recognizes multiple OS's:
This entry is ignored.
The menu will be displayed for the value designated in GRUB_TIMEOUT.
The hidden menu timeout option is not available, as it is bypassed by a conditional in /etc/grub.d/30_os-prober.
The system can still boot without displaying a menu by setting the GRUB_TIMEOUT value to 0, however a timeout delay with a blank screen is not available.
The keystatus check for SHIFT key usage is bypassed by the scripts. Holding down the SHIFT key during boot will not display the menu.
If the user of a multi-OS computer wishes to hide the menu while incorporating a blank screen timeout the scripts in /etc/grub.d/30_os-prober can be modified. Please refer to Grub 2 Title Tweaks.

I believe that is what happens to the computer when the set it up. Not sure if it is relevent information anymore though.

**vinnywright** · Jan 18, 2011, 05:48 PM

Re: Future partitioning help

I think you will be paying the $25 fine a lot .....

if they are putting some kind of windows files on your box then they probably have something to do with booting SUSE and removing them is probably bad.

any extra partitions on the box are not hidden and you can find out with fdisk or parted or a Gparted livecd or just a Kubuntu livecd .... and you can probably acsess the partition and look at any files that may be thare.

I am relatively sure however that if they are actually putting the windows files on it then they are kneaded for some reason .........they maybe even are using some kind of windows boot loader to keep you from monkeying with the setup.

any way if your intent on this course of action post back after you have the box in hand setup the way they are going to do it BUT before you mes with it and we will see what may be done after we explore the setup.

VINNY

**vinnywright** · Jan 18, 2011, 06:00 PM

Re: Future partitioning help

I do have 1 more suggestion for you ......use a liveUSB with a persistence file and leave the HD alone

VINNY

**Linkmaster** · Jan 18, 2011, 06:23 PM

Re: Future partitioning help

Originally posted by vinnywright

I do have 1 more suggestion for you ......use a liveUSB with a persistence file and leave the HD alone

What do you mean by this? Is there a way you can link me to an external source or explain it?

As well, I have no intentions of paying the fine, in fact if I mess the whole thing up, I'll just completely wipe it and use my stuff. Since Linux is amazing, I'll figure out how to connect to the server a different way[Its Novell, and I'm not sure about Kubuntu's compatability with it]. Even just the printer would be good.

And I don't think they are doing that..from what I saw, the Windows files were from the orignal 7 that came on the new boxes. I don't think they have it set up to prevent toying the bootloaders, mainly since tweaking Windows is hard to begin with, but tweaking it to make it load up a Linux without any hint of the Windows working? Sounds pretty far-fetched for me. Just thoughts though.

**vinnywright** · Jan 18, 2011, 06:42 PM

Re: Future partitioning help

Originally posted by vinnywright

I do have 1 more suggestion for you ......use a liveUSB with a persistence file and leave the HD alone

What do you mean by this? Is there a way you can link me to an external source or explain it?

it is vary easy............ in Kickoff>system thar is a program called startup disk creator when you run it you point it to a cd or .ISO file and point it to the usb device then set the amount of space for the persistence file (it's a slider) and make it.(the persistence file is not necessary if you don't want to save anything after a reboot or save anything to it)

then you can set the BIOS to boot the usb (this assums the box is capable.... most are from 5-7 years now) and wala you can run your linux from the usb even if theirs NO hard drive in the box

VINNY

**oshunluvr** · Jan 18, 2011, 06:47 PM

Re: Future partitioning help

...along with three other logical partitions that are "hidden"[since it is set to boot directly to openSUSE]...

The word here that was sticking us was the "hidden". No partitions are usually actually hidden from linux. They may not be mounted, but they aren't hidden. Whereas with windows, unless they are in a windows format (fat, vfat, or ntfs) they won't be accessible at all.

I don't know if any of you are still confused by what I mean, but heres a quote from the http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1195275 link that pretty much describes what happens:[Found in section 5]:

This thread is over 8 months old and indeed back then openSuse was not properly detected. The current 10.10 version of grub-pc should detect it just fine. Remember this is the linux world: problems tend to get repaired much faster than in the windows world. In most cases, posts over two months old are usually old news. As far as the black screen issue - could be grub related or not. We'll have to cross that bridge when we get to it.

**Linkmaster** · Jan 18, 2011, 07:14 PM

Re: Future partitioning help

@oshunluvr:

I apologize for the incorrect terms, thats what they appeared to be like, so thats the word I used. Is there a way to take screenshots using GParted LiveCD? I have that on a CD, and I can use that to show you what the partitions look like so that you have as much information as possible.
Concerning the other quote, I was wondering if it was useful or not.

@vinnywright

So this persistence CD/USB can be used the same as a hard drive?? If so, that will be GREAT! Just wondering what the minimum required space is needed for use

The world of Linux is amazing. I am so glad I got involved with it! And for you guys to help me, even better. Thank you so much!

**vinnywright** · Jan 18, 2011, 08:00 PM

Re: Future partitioning help

as far as the live USB is concerned I have done a 2Gig stick before but after adding codecs for audio and video and a few programs extra their wasn't much space left for storage

even the 4Gig I'm using now after putting a 500-600 Mib linux swap partition at the end of the partition-able space(encase it gets booted on a low RAM box) and adding my favored programs only has about 800 Mib space left for added stuff.....................next will be a 8Gig I saw at the drug store for $20 ......but a 2Gig dose work.......IE the larger the stick the mor room for storage.

as far as the screenshot ........what are you posting from?

you can boot the livecd and use parted to post us the layout of the drive like this ....

open a terminal type

Code:

sudo parted

when it loads type

Code:

print all

and hit enter copy the output hear then type

Code:

quit

and hit enter and it will exit.

A simple

Code:

fdisk -l

thats a lower case L will do simaler but the output is not as human readable .....it displays in bites insted of Mib or Gib..... parted gives better info

VINNY

**Linkmaster** · Jan 18, 2011, 08:23 PM

Re: Future partitioning help

@vinnywright

I shall give the live USB a shot! If I can get my hands on my old stick, haha.

Concerning the screenshot, I'm currently posting from my Kubuntu box. I'm wanting to figure this out BEFORE they put their stuff on my computer. I thought it was possible to take a screenshot while using the GParted LiveCD, since I did it to do some minor editing earlier.

And I won't be able to able to use the parted one, since I don't know the root password for the system

**vinnywright** · Jan 18, 2011, 08:46 PM

Re: Future partitioning help

@vinnywright

I shall give the live USB a shot! If I can get my hands on my old stick, haha.

Concerning the screenshot, I'm currently posting from my Kubuntu box. I'm wanting to figure this out BEFORE they put their stuff on my computer. I thought it was possible to take a screenshot while using the GParted LiveCD, since I did it to do some minor editing earlier.

And I won't be able to able to use the parted one, since I don't know the root password for the system

are you saying your locked out of the BIOS settings?

boot the livecd on it and run it if you can if you cant I doubt you will be able to boot the USB ether

VINNY

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