smart partitioning for dual-boot

[caspermaree]

My Kubuntu KDE4 installation is still very buggy and I am also interested in testing Xubuntu. Is there a way to install a dual-boot configuration with both Xubuntu and Kubuntu that will share the same user packages?? E.g. if I install Amarok in Kubuntu and then reboot I want to run Amarok in Xubuntu and vice versa.
Phrased differently: can I partition my disk during installation such that if I re-install Kubuntu I would not need to re-install my software/packages, e.g. Amarok, Kaffeiene, Netbeans, etc.??

Any help or pointers to appropriate info would be much appreciated because I can't find much useful (or I don't know how to look!)

[arochester]

Re: smart partitioning for dual-boot

You shouldn't need to dual boot between Kubuntu and Xubuntu.

You should just load Xubuntu on the same boot. You can choose which desktop you use on the login page where you put your username and password. On the icon on the bottom right you choose the Session Type.

Connect to the internet and in Konsole Terminal Program input:

sudo apt-get install xubuntu-desktop

[divide0]

Re: smart partitioning for dual-boot

Another thing you might want to try with Xubuntu: If you've got a 2GB or higher flashdrive, you could try installing Xubuntu on it instead of partitioning your HDD. Xubuntu doesn't need alot of room to install (only 1.5GB), and doesn't need alot of RAM to run (I think it can run on about 192-256MB quite efficiently). Sometimes installing two "Buntus" on the same boot can lead to problems, such as scattered applications (although Xfce doesn't have to worry about that as much as Gnome) used by both installs. However, unless you would like a completely separate install, having Xubuntu and Kubuntu on the same boot shouldn't be a problem.

[caspermaree]

Re: smart partitioning for dual-boot

Thanks, but I actually want to run both independently so that I can experiment and break things (which I seem to do more often than not) in one OS and still have the other one intact. I just don't want to install the same software packages twice (bandwidth isn't cheap here) and therefore I would like to partition the installation so that I can run the same installed packages from both OS installations or if I re-install one that I can "point" it to the already installed packages. Is this possible?
E.g. if I partition the disk in 3 and install/mount Xubuntu root on one, Kubuntu or Debian on the next and /usr on the third?

[dibl]

Re: smart partitioning for dual-boot

I wouldn't try sharing /usr -- that sounds like trouble looking for a place to happen.

Since you really want both full OS's, and seem to have some constraints on your disk space, I'd do it like this, assuming a clean start with nothing installed:

Partitions:

1. 6GB (for the future Kubuntu)
2. 4GB (for the future Xubuntu)
3. 1GB (for swap -- you didn't say how much memory you have, so I have to guess)
4. THE REST OF IT -- for your data. You can make this an extended partition, if you wish, and put multiple logical partitions in it, if that is helpful.

I would install the entire Xubuntu filesystem first, on partition #2, with swap on #3. You can let it write grub on the mbr if you want, or not, -- it doesn't matter. Then I would install Kubuntu on partition #1 and tell it to write grub on the mbr. It will search and find the Xubuntu installation and list that on your boot menu.

When you boot either of your *buntus, they will of course have empty home directories. I would not save real data in them. Instead, make your "Documents", "Music", "Images", "Porn" or whatever directories on that #4 partition, or in logical partitions within it, and then you can symlink them into the /home directories in your *buntu systems. That way you need never concern yourself with the size of the *buntu filesystems -- they are plenty big for the OS and all your packages. Just keep the data elsewhere as explained, and you'll be at maximum hard drive efficiency.

[caspermaree]

Re: smart partitioning for dual-boot

Thanx once again!

However, that's not quite what I want to achieve. Currently I have 4 partitions: swap, home, Ubuntu root and Kubuntu root. When I installed both of the *buntus I mounted the same home and swap partitions. Thus, the home is "shared". This works very well for all my data needs.

What I want to achieve is to install a package, e.g. Adobe Reader, in say Kubuntu and when I reboot into Ubuntu (Xubuntu in future) want that same package available without the need to reinstall or download it again with the package manager. Any further ideas please??

[aged hippy]

Re: smart partitioning for dual-boot

If i may make a suggestion it would be to read this topic: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=205002 and from within your Ubuntu installation, to install the xubuntu-desktop as shown.
Your /home directory is shared by both desktops, and you can choose which desktop you wish to use at the login screen.

I am - at the moment - in a Kubuntu desktop, but i followed the instructions there and also installed the Gnome one, i have only installed Firefox and Thunderbird once, but i can access them from either desktop via the menu.

To change desktops, it is merely a matter of logging out, select the other session, then log-in.


I think that this is what you are looking for, but - of course - may well be completely wrong.

[caspermaree]

Re: smart partitioning for dual-boot

My problem actually has nothing to do with multiple desktops or sharing a home partition.
I want to have 2 versions of Ubuntu installed for specific reasons, but when I install software packages in one and reboot into the other, I want thoses packages automatically in the other so that I don't need to download them twice.

What would help is if I could figure out exactly where the package manager puts all the stuff it installs. I've read that in days gone by software was installed in /usr/local and these days they also use /opt, however the things I've installed lately with apt-get didn't end up there. So, does anyone know were apt-get (or dpkg) installs software and packages in the filesystem?

[tinker]

Re: smart partitioning for dual-boot

My problem actually has nothing to do with multiple desktops or sharing a home partition.

Well, if I read your posts correctly, I think it actually might since you mention booting between Kubuntu and Ubuntu. The advice of other posters to install the different desktops and choose from the desktop manager (at login) which desktop you want to use for that session will actually give you something like what you described. You would be using the desktop environment you chose but have access to whichever binaries are installed in the system.

KDE is a desktop environment (usually just called a desktop), not to be confused with the different "desktops" (i.e. 1,2,3,4.etc.) that KDE can furnish for you during a KDE session. It is default for Kubuntu.
GNOME is a desktop environment that is default for Ubuntu.

Either of those, or any other that you have installed can be chosen from the desktop manager at login for the current session. What you have chosen will be your desktop for that session until you log out and choose another or shutdown.

Unless I am confused and not reading your posts correctly you should probably reread what the other posters have mentioned.

I want to have 2 versions of Ubuntu installed for specific reasons, but when I install software packages in one and reboot into the other, I want thoses packages automatically in the other so that I don't need to download them twice.

You could choose to have two separate installs and each would be separate but each would have to keep track of what the other had installed in order to do what you want and I can't think of a way to do that because the other OS likely wouldn't even be mounted while the one you are working in was up. Unless, you chose some method to syncronize the two systems partitions.

It probably would be possible to share the apt cache (the place where the .debs are saved when they are downloaded before the package manager installs them) and thus only have to use the bandwidth once. However, in order to do that it is necessary that the system be optioned so that they are not automagically deleted after the install finishes and have a way to mount that cache in the proper location on whichever OS you had booted, in that case they (the debs) would be in the cache and you wouldn't have to download them again, but you would have to install them again because they were installed on the other OS on the other partition. Or some method (i.e. unison) to keep a separate cache in each OS syncronized. A third method that could help by saving the bandwidth for downloading is for you to keep a local repository of debs installed on your system but that is a bit more advanced concept that I suggest you use a search engine to research.

What would help is if I could figure out exactly where the package manager puts all the stuff it installs. I've read that in days gone by software was installed in /usr/local and these days they also use /opt, however the things I've installed lately with apt-get didn't end up there. So, does anyone know were apt-get (or dpkg) installs software and packages in the filesystem?

Generally, it puts them where they belong in the file system and it is coded into the .deb that you use to install as per the standard. It's much too lengthy to explain here but if you want to look at the Linux Filesystem Hierarchy explained:
http://tldp.org/LDP/Linux-Filesystem...tml/index.html

You have synaptic on your Ubuntu install, right? If I remember correctly, it has a tab on the property sheet for each package that shows installed files for the package and lists the full filepath (where it is installed).

In order to have a situation like I think you are describing, I rsync my working system to a partition that I have designated as test and put an entry in grub for it. If I'm going to be breaking things (or do I mean testing), I boot to the test partition and if something gets unfixably broken, all I have to do is reboot to the good partition and mount the one that needs fixing and fix it or mount it and chroot into it to fix it. If I can't fix it, I could just use rsync to overwrite it with the good system partition. I also use the same /home because I almost never break the system writing in /home (don't necessarily try this with divergent major distros though, I 'm not sure I would with very different versions of the same distro). Of course there are many more ways to do this and you might choose other partition cloning methods than rsync or different syncronizing method than unison.

It might be easier to just backup your working system before breaking it and restoring after you break it, that's the way some people achieve what I think you are describing.

I hope some of this has helped and not clouded the issue further, I think it's worth reading the man page for some of those binaries mentioned, if you are unfamiliar with them, it could help as you decide on the method that will work best for your style. How good are you with the command line, or should we stick to GUIs?