[SOLVED] Kubutu still bugs the hell out of me, from time to time :o(

[RipRapRob]

Well, you allmost had me convinced Kubuntu was ready to take over the world this time.

After testing a number of distributions, I finally chose Kubuntu as 'my' flavor of Linux.

The last few versions of Kubuntu made me very excited: Fast upstart and automatic configuration. Even my wireless NIC worked at first try.

I was allmost convinced that NOW - with ver. 8.04 - there was a version of Kubuntu I could recommend to my Windows using friends. Or at least make them test it.

But then, small cracks started to show...

Let me use today as an example:

I decided to try out the newest version of the Opera browser - version 9.5 - and tried to install it, as a Windows user would do - without using the Terminal and all the command line stuff, I really could live without.

First I went to Add/Remove programs. No Opera.

Then I went to Adept and searched for Opera. No Opera browser. What?!?

Ah, add repository for Third Party software (a lot of Windows users would have given up here).

New search for Opera. There it is. But what version? No info. Duh! Installed it anyway.

But it was an old version. Went to www.opera.com to get it (most Windows users would have started here).

There is was, choose version, download. I really thought I was close to my goal.

Downloaded DEB-package. Last time I did that manually, was a long time ago, running an older version of Kubuntu. Rightclick and searched for Install or something, but NOTHING. No way to install anymore. WTF?

Hmm, maybe I remember it wrong? Download as GZ.TAR to desktop. Open TAR-file, extract all files. Looking for extracted files. No files found?

OK, must be me getting tired. Tried again. Same result. Third time lucky? Mark open folder after extraction. No files ?!?!? Gimmeabreak!

Maybe I'm supposed to go down one level in the TAR-file before extracting? I'll try that. Suddenly Ark informs me that it is unable to preview... And this box cannot be closed. Not even right click and choosing close works. Sigh!

Hmmm, maybe something is wrong with the TAR-file. Delete. Empty cache. Restart Kubuntu (yeah, I'm getting paranoid by now). Download again.

Hey, the Ark preview error that cannot be closed is reproduceable. 'Great'. And it turns out that clicking the OK button just hides the box under the preview thingy. Resize. Click the same damn box I've clicked before several times before and NOW it closes.

Searches the Net the way a Windows user would. Ends up on sites with endless and cryptic SUDO commands to be typed, with NO explanation what so ever of what a command does (or why it is named that way - might make it easier to remember) or what this and why you have to add things like -u - p and -y - o -u -r -s. An such helpfull advice as: "If it's not in Adapt, your are not supposed to install it".

No wonder some Windows users hate some Linux users.

So the DEB-package is my last and best bet. Surely there MUST be a way to start the installation just by clicking and typing my password? No?

But, alas, I had to give up. No way to install it in an easy way (

Off course sudo dpkg -i opera_9.50.etch-qt3_i386.deb solved MY problem.

But Kubuntu still isn't ready for the average user who can't be bothered to use the terminal and type in commands.

Is there a way for a newbie to install Opera 9.5 without typing commands?

[toad]

Re: Kubutu still bugs the hell out of me, from time to time (

Linux is not windows and things are not the same. Imaging you've been flying a little propeller plane and are standing in front of fighter jet. That is the situation you are in now. Persevere and you will reap the benefits!

As for opera, I'd use a repository, have a look here http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=272742

[dibl]

Re: Kubutu still bugs the hell out of me, from time to time (

I will deviate for 10 seconds from my strictly-held policy of never arguing on line, because it is such a dumb way to spend time ....

[rant]

Nobody on this forum ever claimed Kubuntu is ready to take over the world -- why would you want to do that?

Nothing you have written is a fault with Kubuntu, or with version 8.04. There may be "cracks", but you didn't find any. Matter of fact, what you did was to end-run the *buntu developers' carefully designed repository and configuration control system, and downloaded an incompatible piece of software and installed it, or attempted to.

If you could download a Microsoft MS Access application and attempt to install it on a Win XP Home OS that doesn't have MS Office Pro installed, you'd get about the same result. But you can't do that because it's all proprietary and has to be purchased with a key, so we don't hear about those nightmares.

/rant


OK, back to constructive criticism. I don't know whether Opera 9.5 is packaged for *buntu 8.04 yet or not -- maybe it's not. The Debian packaging system is the means by which we avoid problems with applications that aren't fully supported by the OS. If you add the third party repos to Adept Manager, and "fetch", then you can open Adept Manager and have your choice of the 22,000+ packages that are listed there. If there's an Opera listed there, you CAN investigate the version details and the dependencies by simply clicking on the name of it.

It's not advisable to randomly download software -- especially non-packaged tarballs -- and attempt to install them directly. Debian packages are considerably safer, but not guaranteed trouble-free, depending on how your system is configured. KPackage is a lovely way to install .debs, for example, but you need to install KPackage before you use it to install your .deb package. If it happens that there is an Opera 9.5 .deb that is compatible with the architecture and library of your installed Kubuntu 8.04 system, then KPackage would be the way to install it without ever seeing the command line.

[RipRapRob]

Re: Kubutu still bugs the hell out of me, from time to time (

To the "Imagine you been flying..." analogy: I very much doubt fighter planes is controlled by command line. I think they have a more user friendly user interface.

I was expecting , I dunno, maybe something like: "Need more software? Simply choose from thousands of software packages in the Ubuntu catalogue, all available to download and install at the click of a button."

Well, seems you can't click your way to the new Opera doe's it?

To the "I will deviate for 10 seconds from my strictly-held policy of never arguing on line,"

Ah, you should have used those 10 seconds to check the Opera website - then you would have seen that Opera IS packaged for *ubuntu 8.04.

Guess the Mac-fanboys aren't the most annoying fanboys after all.

[toad]

Re: Kubutu still bugs the hell out of me, from time to time (

Guess the Mac-fanboys aren't the most annoying fanboys after all.

Are you trying to pick a fight? In that case please stop posting. You started ranting, so do not complain when you get on peoples' nerves, especially when they are trying to help you.

And have you understood the difference between installing from a repository and an individual package? If not, feel free to ask. In any case, I suggest the former as stated in my previous post.

And as for flying - sure, you just step in a fighter jet and off you go

[Fintan]

Re: Kubutu still bugs the hell out of me, from time to time (

Google is your friend:
http://monkeyblog.org/ubuntu/installing/

The latest opera has not yet been ported to the repos list. I guess they have their priorities as well.

So:

installing opera:
download HH .deb package.

Install KPackage:

sudo apt-get install KPackage

or the long way:
open adept package manager>search>KPackage>install

Click on your opera.deb file it will automatically launch KPackage. One more click.
Presto.

With KPackage installed this whole process takes less than 5min.
And look ma, no restarting

As for fighter pilots.
Well they don't have easier user interfaces but 4 brains.
three computers (plus a redundant backup system for each) and on brain between their ears.

ADD-ON:
If you would keep on comparing your old girlfriend / wife / lover to your new / now one you would be in serious trouble mate :P

[RipRapRob]

Re: Kubutu still bugs the hell out of me, from time to time (

Are you trying to pick a fight?

LOL, grow up!

Install KPackage:

sudo apt-get install KPackage

Thank you so much, for an answer I could use for something. After installing KPackage I can click-install Opera

And I think I found out another reason why Kubuntu started to bug me: Switching back to KDE 3 (actually 3.5.something) and a lot of other things started working as I expected them to, and made it possible to customize things to my liking.

(And don't get me started on comparing girlfriends - I works for me: That's how I finally found the one I've married)