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    #1

    Dual Booting Linux on an external usb hard drive, Vista on the internal C drive,

    I used an old ide hard drive in an io magic external usb adapter, ~ $30 at Radio Shack. I originally thought to do this with an internal 'swapable' caddy; but they're more expensive and the bezel on my current pc doesn't allow for it. I think the method described here actually worked out better.

    Why no MBR change - I've done dual boot many times and ways and Windows has never 'played nice'. It always managed to mess up something and refuse to start. I expect Vista to be just as unfriendly. It's worse with partitioning a single physical drive but even separate drives have been problems.

    1. Check the bios. To do this press the F2 ( usually F2 ) key immediately after turning on the pc.
    The following should be available in any modern bios.

    .The pc boot order should be set to optical disc ( or dvd/cd ) first, before the hard drive(s).
    .Boot from usb device ( or external usb ) should be enabled.
    .Allow boot choice menu ( usually by pressing F10 on starting ) should be enabled.

    For convenience place the install disk in the cd/dvd drive ( but don't install yet, just turn off the pc )

    The trick to ensuring no MBR change is to open the case of the pc and temporarily unplug the power and data leads to the hard drive before installing Linux on the external drive. There's usually several unused connectors so it's probably best to make a note of which ones were originally used on the drive ( they're usually labeled ). If there are two internal drives then I think this method may also work if Linux is installed to the 2nd drive. ( Vista may be different - I don't know - but Windows previously always insisted on being installed on the first physical drive )

    REMEMBER - before opening the case turn off the pc and the power surge protector, unplug it and then press and hold the on button to fully discharge.

    Close the case; plug in the external drive to the usb port; Power up the external drive. Then start the pc; it should boot from the install disk. Install whatever version of Linux ( I've done this with both Suse and Kubuntu ). The internal drive won't be touched of course and the system will place Grub or whatever on the usb drive mbr with no knowledge of the internal drive.
    Once the install is done remove the cd and reboot from the external drive to check all is well.

    Now power down both the external drive and then the pc. Again ensure the pc is fully discharged as above then reconnect the internal drive. Button it up, then turn on the pc while leaving the external drive off. Windows should start up fine, none the wiser.

    Now turn the pc off. Turn the external drive on, then restart the pc. Press F10 to start the boot choice menu
    and choose the external drive with Linux on it. ( if your bios does not support a boot choice menu then you will have to enter the bios menu and set the start up order to the external drive before the internal ).

    I don't take Windows out on the web ( except for the endless update patches ) and have locked Vista down enough re file sharing and access that I feel ( perhaps foolishly ) able to avoid the virus 'tax'; the cost of McAffee or other antivirus program. That's enough cash to buy a new drive if I hadn't had an old one handy.

    Notes
    1. If there are any booting problems with Vista use the bootrec ( NOT bootsect ) tool.
    See http://suport.microsoft.com/kb/927392 and also http://neosmart.net/blog/2007/sootse...or-no-the-mbr/
    Basically
    1. Put the Vista install disc in and start the pc
    2. Press a key, select a languag, time, currency, keyboard, then click Next
    3. Click 'Repaair your computer'
    4. Click the os to repair, then click next
    5. In the 'System Recovery Options' choose 'Command Prompt'
    6. Type
    Bootrec.exe /fixmbr
    Bootrec.exe /fixboot
    Bootrec.exe /rebuildbcd

    Vista is different from XP, etc in not having a boot.ini.
    Repairing boot problems on it is different.

    2. When running Linux Suse seemed to see the Vista ntfs drive whereas Kubuntu did not.
    I have read that there can be big problems trying to modify Vista partitions/drives with Linux tools. So be cautious.

    3.Cyril Voisin has an article on 'How to use Windows Vista’s Boot Manager to boot Linux' which is interesting.
    It may be that Windows will behave better if it calls another os using its own methods, not Grub or Lilo.

    http://port25.technet.com/archive/20...M-Support.aspx

    4. MBR - Master Boot Record. The first sector of the hard drive.It contains a map of the partition(s) on the drive and enough code for the intial bios boot code in rom to find the bootloader/bootsector code on the hard drive to load an operating system.
    http://www.goodells.net/multiboot/bootbkgd.ht
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Master_boot_record
    Tags: None
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    #2
    Re: Dual Booting Linux on an external usb hard drive, Vista on the internal C drive,

    Consider using EasyBCD by Neosmart Technologies to contol the boot process when Windoze Vista is the installed OS on the first HD. I'm using it and it is great. Read about it here.
    Windows no longer obstructs my view.
    Using Kubuntu Linux since March 23, 2007.
    "It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data." - Sherlock Holmes​
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      #3
      Re: Dual Booting Linux on an external usb hard drive, Vista on the internal C dr

      Yes, what Snowhog said. The work of Computer Guru, his EasyBCD website.

      Your how-to is interesting, though perhaps just a bit dated, but it's clear you really know what's going on here. Very nicely done. And it offers a hardware approach to doing this task.

      The partition editor GParted has been used with success to mess with Vista partitioning issues, apparently without problems.
      See: Vista *** The definitive dual-booting guide: Linux, Vista and XP step-by-step (uses EasyBCD):
      http://apcmag.com/dualboot

      When you install Kubuntu to the external drive, it's easy to put GRUB where you want it to be, which should be simply the MBR of the external drive, and which could be handy for other reasons as well. To do this, use the Alternate installer CD Or use the regular Live CD Desktop version, watch for Step 6 of the Manual partitioning method, click the Advanced button (lower right), and there you may specify where you want the installer to put GRUB, which in your example would be (hd1) -- the MBR of the second drive as seen by BIOS (assuming only the two drives). No harm done in doing that at all, and it meets your objective of not touching the MBR on the internal drive.
      An intellectual says a simple thing in a hard way. An artist says a hard thing in a simple way. Charles Bukowski
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        #4
        Re: Dual Booting Linux on an external usb hard drive, Vista on the internal C drive,

        Qqmike - Thank you for the information on how to install Grub to a specific drive ( and shame on me for not noticing this option ). It certainly is easier than physically taking a drive off line. I'll have to retry with Suse too.

        SnowHog - Thank you for mentioning EasyBCD. I'll check it out. However earlier problems with software/partitioning based dual boot methods.have led me to feel that the best way to keep Windows a good neighbor is not to let it know that it has neighbors. I use it for games and certain applications; but it doesn't have to know about the other os's in my life :-)
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          #5
          Re: Dual Booting Linux on an external usb hard drive, Vista on the internal C drive,

          Originally posted by DJ
          SnowHog - Thank you for mentioning EasyBCD. I'll check it out. However earlier problems with software/partitioning based dual boot methods.have led me to feel that the best way to keep Windows a good neighbor is not to let it know that it has neighbors.
          You'll find that EasyBCD does just that. It does what it says, so check out the web sight. Vista, which is VERY cautious in the way it acts and controls access, both by user and by programs, doesn't even know what's going on. I've been dual booting Vista and Kubuntu with absolutely no problems what so ever - none.
          Windows no longer obstructs my view.
          Using Kubuntu Linux since March 23, 2007.
          "It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data." - Sherlock Holmes​
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            #6
            Re: Dual Booting Linux on an external usb hard drive, Vista on the internal C drive,

            Addendum on Using Advanced install to fix MBR location.
            1. When Grub is placed on hd1 vice hd0 using the manual partitioning advanced install with the Internal drive with windows active it seems that the entries created for Grub in the
            /media/disk/boot/grub/menu.lst
            file have to be modified before one may boot correctly.
            All the following ( hd0,0) entries - which are for the linux drive - are created as (hd1,0) and the
            (hd1,0) entry for Vista on the internal drive is created as (hd0,0)
            Once they are reversed as below and the boot order in the bios set to boot from the external usb drive before the internal drive, the system will always boot into Grub but will allow the choice of either Linux or Vista.

            ## ## End Default Options ##

            title Ubuntu 7.10, kernel 2.6.22-14-generic
            root (hd0,0)
            .....
            .....
            title Ubuntu 7.10, kernel 2.6.22-14-generic (recovery mode)
            root (hd0,0)
            ......
            .....
            title Ubuntu 7.10, memtest86+
            root (hd0,0)
            ....
            ### END DEBIAN AUTOMAGIC KERNELS LIST

            # This is a divider, added to separate the menu items below from the Debian
            # ones.
            title Other operating systems:
            root

            # This entry automatically added by the Debian installer for a non-linux OS
            # on /dev/sda1
            title Windows Vista/Longhorn (loader)
            root (hd1,0)
            savedefault
            chainloader +1


            Initially Linux wouldn't start after installation with the original entries in the
            /media/disk/boot/grub/menu.lst file.
            There's probably many ways to correct this seeming Catch-22.
            I restarted the system using the install CD and from the live version ran the nano editor as root

            Kmenu - run - nano /media/disk/boot/grub/menu.lst
            with the options of 'run as different user' - root and 'run in terminal'
            Use the arrow keys to move; delete to delete, enter the new value.
            Control O to write out( save ) and Control x to exit

            Note that for the menu to be shown on start up the line
            #hiddenmenu
            in the menu.lst file should be commented with the # as here )

            Of course the external usb drive must be on. However If it is turned off the bios will
            simply remove it from the drive list and booting will be done on the C Vista drive. The next time one
            wants Linux the boot order in the drive will have to be changed.

            2. On the advanced install ( select 'Manual' on the 'Prepare disk space' section; the external drive
            will probably be referenced as /dev/sdb; values I used were primary, location at beginning,
            ext3, mount point / ; allow .5 to 1 gig for swap space at end ).

            3. http://en.opensuse.org/Installing_Su...rnal_USB_Drive discusses this for Suse.

            I'm still learning. Hope this is of use to someone.
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              #7
              Re: Dual Booting Linux on an external usb hard drive, Vista on the internal C dr

              Hey DJ—looks like you’re still at it, the mark of a hooked Linux expert. Good job!

              You might want to check out my How To:

              How To Make GRUB Thumb Drive
              http://kubuntuforums.net/forums/inde...opic=3081748.0
              (Other How-To’s are referenced there, too.)

              It’s written for a USB flash drive, but it applies to external USB HDDs as well. The various posts under the topic address various subjects, including installing Kubuntu to an external USB drive (newly revised & expanded, btw). Reply #5 & #8 address the well-know BIOS issue of drive shifting, which is what I think you discovered here. You can buy an inexpensive flash drive and experiment, if you wish, and everything you learn will carry over to the internal USB HDDs. (On sale, flash drives are $10/GB or slightly less—right now CompUSA has 1 GB Kingstons at about $10.) In that How-To, there’s also a new post on putting Super Grub Disk, your own boot menu, and Puppy Linux on a flash drive, another good experiment to play with.

              If you devise something new on your own, a new way, a new application, you may start your own How-To (under Documentation > How To’s).

              Please post any questions you encounter back here, as you have, in the forum under Installation & Boot. Lots of us here have gathered experience messing with booting and can help.

              Another must-read, standard How To is herman’s at:
              Bigpond, home: http://users.bigpond.net.au/hermanzone/
              See the GRUB page, filesystems (mounting, etc.), and other topics on booting/dual-booting and Linux.
              And psychocats, a standard reference::
              Psychocats: http://www.psychocats.net/ubuntu/index.php
              tuxfiles is really good (I think, the best!) getting folks started at the command line, file systems, mounting, etc.
              Tuxfiles: http://www.tuxfiles.org/

              An intellectual says a simple thing in a hard way. An artist says a hard thing in a simple way. Charles Bukowski
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