Start up list.

[Snowhog]

Re: Start up list.

Hmmm. Seems that when you are running grub, you loose the path environment, so grub doesn't know where to look except where you are.

[Qqmike]

Re: Start up list.

(wavemaker) So, it looks like this (maybe?):

The Kubuntu you use daily, your “good” one is on hda2. And that one is Ubuntu, kernel 2.6.20-15-generic (the “older” version, strangely!).

The “other” Kubuntu is on hda4 and is Ubuntu, kernel 2.6.20-16-generic (the newer” version).

Hmmm. If you trace the steps back in this thread, isn’t that what it looks like? It would make sense in a way – that this new “other” Kubuntu somehow pops up further on the hard drive, at hda4, and not up front at hda2.
Strange situation.

Based on this, I’d say you could delete the partition hda4, but gosh, I hope that’s right!

Can you get into your “good” Kubuntu and access /boot/grub/menu.lst and copy that file and post it here?

I’m wondering what the default operating system is for you when you first turn on the PC and see the boot menu. What is highlighted? It should be the Kubuntu on hda2, the Ubuntu, kernel 2.6.20-15-generic.


As for Automatix, I’m not sure what to do about that! That is a question we have to wait for some one to pop in an help with. But it could be dealt with later, after simplifying the picture by getting rid of one of those Kubuntu partitions; or, for awhile, just ignore the Automatix issue since you will only have one Kubuntu to be updated. But first, how about the menu.lst copied from the “good” Kubuntu on hda2.

[Qqmike]

Re: Start up list.

dibl, I’m looking at yours here, too. Yep. Puzzling, as the dickens.
I’m so tired, I may have to take a break and come back to it all . . .

Now, the usual thing to do in cases like yours, and we’ve all had something similar, though maybe not quite as mysterious, is to see if you can boot that sucker by hook or by crook – ANY way possible.

Super Grub Disk.
The manual methods, like
root (hdx,y)
configfile /boot/grub/menu.lst
or by direct booting with the root, kernel, initrd, boot statements at a grub>.

Sometimes, SGD Live CD can reveal something interesting about how it is seeing your drives and OSs.
As you know, with SGD you can just keep trying different things, one after the other, as you also can manually at a grub>.

That’s puzzling that it won’t boot from the menu, with Error 15 . . .

The other thing is device.map. Does it look right? (Of course, device.map is another story, one that can get complicated. GRUB does not look at device.map when you boot up and see the GRUB menu.lst. But I know Herman has seen cases where the solution was in setting the right device.map, for some reason which is also a ? )

[Qqmike]

Re: Start up list.

(dibl) One more thought. It’s on the “Linux” /dev/sdc1, as you say. Now, how exactly does GRUB see sdc1? GRUB sees sdc1 the same way BIOS sees it, as some (hdx,y). If the x and y are wrong in menu.lst, wrong from the view of BIOS (and therefore GRUB), well, it’s dead and won’t go to what you think is the real, physical sdc1, if you get me here.

grub> geometry (hd<TAB key>

What comes back?
Then explore each one
grub> geometry (hd0)
grub> geometry (hd1)
grub> geometry (hd2)
etc.

[Qqmike]

Re: Start up list.

dibl, in the spirit of brainstorming, since this sort of thing can be either completely simple or terribly profound,
it wouldn’t hurt to check the UUIDs.

UUIDs, listing:
From Live CD or hard drive: ls /dev/disk/by-uuid/ -alh
From hard drive: blkid
Kind of off-the-wall, but best to rule it out, nail it down, put a lid on it, . . .



Wavemaker,
Come back with menu.lst when you catch your breathe. I may take off for awhile here, too.

[dibl]

Re: Start up list.

(dibl) GRUB sees sdc1 the same way BIOS sees it, as some (hdx,y). If the x and y are wrong in menu.lst, wrong from the view of BIOS (and therefore GRUB), well, it’s dead and won’t go to what you think is the real, physical sdc1, if you get me here.

Yep. Thanks Qqmike -- I think this was the nature of my problem. That #$%$ IDE drive was listed as a "hd0" in Grub, but an "sda" in Ubuntu. I lost track of the fact that my Ubuntu installation is actually on sdd, as far as it knows, not hd2, which is a different drive in Grub-speak. When I changed it to hd3 in Grub, it got very happy. All fixed up now -- thanks!

[Qqmike]

Re: Start up list.

dibl, Great! Way to go!

And now, as we know, there's the additional factor that the new Linux device naming is all sdx, no more hdx, right? . . . unless that isn't yet fully implemented, even though it's already shown up in many cases I've seen starting with 7.04.

Yeah, sdx is Linux-talk, but may have little to do with corresponding hdx in BIOS/GRUB-talk.

Glad you got it, dibl.

[dibl]

Re: Start up list.

Thanks!

It's a little complicated, but I got it. Here's the /etc/fstab:

# /etc/fstab: static file system information.
#
# <file system> <mount point>  <type> <options>    <dump> <pass>
proc      /proc      proc  defaults    0    0
# /dev/sdd1
UUID=cffddf89-57f3-40ab-a97f-40bb1ea45f16 /        reiserfs notail     0    1
# /dev/sdd3
UUID=9b7658da-59e1-4b2b-a4b9-fa3ee11b68cf /home      reiserfs defaults    0    2
# /dev/sda1
UUID=c05e4a91-fe68-4725-9610-2dc108ef64ff /media/sda1	reiserfs defaults	 0	 2
# /dev/sda3
UUID=4157eb7a-7a16-4ce7-8774-06f247c61dc6 /media/sda3	reiserfs defaults	 0	 2
# /dev/sda2
# UUID=2cfb64cb-601f-4dad-b7ae-ef32bff55358 none   swap sw    0    0
# /dev/sdb1
UUID=d34baccd-cebc-4a88-b8a2-905d6cd0415a /media/sdb1	 reiserfs defaults	 0	 2
# /dev/sdb2
UUID=a6c2ba7b-8492-4746-92af-5182dcb4daab /media/sdb2	 reiserfs defaults	 0	 2
# /dev/sdc1
UUID=1ddd0144-0875-4667-9f98-e90a23f58ff3 /media/sdc1   reiserfs defaults    0    2
# /dev/sdc2
UUID=710efad8-9f97-4bcd-8f57-8f8cc1facc2f /media/sdc2   reiserfs defaults    0    2
# /dev/sdc3
UUID=f1912a56-2e5c-45ce-b91b-3ebbe69e20f4 /media/sdc3   reiserfs defaults    0    2
# /dev/sde1
UUID=d182b7c3-298c-49b3-ac66-b378033b815c /media/sde1   reiserfs defaults    0    2
# /dev/sdd2
UUID=b5ba0fcf-2b10-47d1-bcd7-c0b176766eda none      swap  sw       0    0
/dev/scd0    /media/cdrom0  udf,iso9660 user,noauto   0    0
/dev/fd0    /media/floppy0 auto  rw,user,noauto 0    0

[wavemaker]

Re: Start up list.

james@office:~$ /boot/grub/menu.lst
bash: /boot/grub/menu.lst: Permission denied
james@office:~$

Here is what I got for that. The one highlighted is the one at the top of the list.
Ubuntu, kernel 2.6.20-16-generic. Thanks

[kubicle]

Re: Start up list.

james@office:~$ /boot/grub/menu.lst
bash: /boot/grub/menu.lst: Permission denied

It's not executable and only root-readable, if you wish to view the file in the console:

sudo cat /boot/grub/menu.lst

and editing:

sudo nano /boot/grub/menu.lst

(console editor) or

kdesu kate /boot/grub/menu.lst

(GUI editor)

[wavemaker]

Re: Start up list.


james@office:~$ sudo cat /boot/grub/menu.lst
# menu.lst - See: grub(8), info grub, update-grub(8)
# grub-install(8), grub-floppy(8),
# grub-md5-crypt, /usr/share/doc/grub
# and /usr/share/doc/grub-doc/.

## default num
# Set the default entry to the entry number NUM. Numbering starts from 0, and
# the entry number 0 is the default if the command is not used.
#
# You can specify 'saved' instead of a number. In this case, the default entry
# is the entry saved with the command 'savedefault'.
# WARNING: If you are using dmraid do not change this entry to 'saved' or your
# array will desync and will not let you boot your system.
default 0

## timeout sec
# Set a timeout, in SEC seconds, before automatically booting the default entry
# (normally the first entry defined).
timeout 10

## hiddenmenu
# Hides the menu by default (press ESC to see the menu)
#hiddenmenu

# Pretty colours
#color cyan/blue white/blue

## password ['--md5'] passwd
# If used in the first section of a menu file, disable all interactive editing
# control (menu entry editor and command-line) and entries protected by the
# command 'lock'
# e.g. password topsecret
# password --md5 $1$gLhU0/$aW78kHK1QfV3P2b2znUoe/
# password topsecret

#
# examples
#
# title Windows 95/98/NT/2000
# root (hd0,0)
# makeactive
# chainloader +1
#
# title Linux
# root (hd0,1)
# kernel /vmlinuz root=/dev/hda2 ro
#

#
# Put static boot stanzas before and/or after AUTOMAGIC KERNEL LIST

### BEGIN AUTOMAGIC KERNELS LIST
## lines between the AUTOMAGIC KERNELS LIST markers will be modified
## by the debian update-grub script except for the default options below

## DO NOT UNCOMMENT THEM, Just edit them to your needs

## ## Start Default Options ##
## default kernel options
## default kernel options for automagic boot options
## If you want special options for specific kernels use kopt_x_y_z
## where x.y.z is kernel version. Minor versions can be omitted.
## e.g. kopt=root=/dev/hda1 ro
## kopt_2_6_8=root=/dev/hdc1 ro
## kopt_2_6_8_2_686=root=/dev/hdc2 ro
# kopt=root=UUID=35d40448-60b4-4625-b6a6-59fa669712fc ro

## Setup crashdump menu entries
## e.g. crashdump=1
# crashdump=0

## default grub root device
## e.g. groot=(hd0,0)
# groot=(hd0,1)

## should update-grub create alternative automagic boot options
## e.g. alternative=true
## alternative=false
# alternative=true

## should update-grub lock alternative automagic boot options
## e.g. lockalternative=true
## lockalternative=false
# lockalternative=false

## additional options to use with the default boot option, but not with the
## alternatives
## e.g. defoptions=vga=791 resume=/dev/hda5
# defoptions=quiet splash

## should update-grub lock old automagic boot options
## e.g. lockold=false
## lockold=true
# lockold=false

## Xen hypervisor options to use with the default Xen boot option
# xenhopt=

## Xen Linux kernel options to use with the default Xen boot option
# xenkopt=console=tty0

## altoption boot targets option
## multiple altoptions lines are allowed
## e.g. altoptions=(extra menu suffix) extra boot options
## altoptions=(recovery) single
# altoptions=(recovery mode) single

## controls how many kernels should be put into the menu.lst
## only counts the first occurence of a kernel, not the
## alternative kernel options
## e.g. howmany=all
## howmany=7
# howmany=all

## should update-grub create memtest86 boot option
## e.g. memtest86=true
## memtest86=false
# memtest86=true

## should update-grub adjust the value of the default booted system
## can be true or false
# updatedefaultentry=false

## ## End Default Options ##

title Ubuntu, kernel 2.6.20-16-generic
root (hd0,1)
kernel /boot/vmlinuz-2.6.20-16-generic root=UUID=35d40448-60b4-4625-b6a6-59fa669712fc ro quiet splash
initrd /boot/initrd.img-2.6.20-16-generic
quiet
savedefault

title Ubuntu, kernel 2.6.20-16-generic (recovery mode)
root (hd0,1)
kernel /boot/vmlinuz-2.6.20-16-generic root=UUID=35d40448-60b4-4625-b6a6-59fa669712fc ro single
initrd /boot/initrd.img-2.6.20-16-generic

title Ubuntu, kernel 2.6.20-15-generic
root (hd0,1)
kernel /boot/vmlinuz-2.6.20-15-generic root=UUID=35d40448-60b4-4625-b6a6-59fa669712fc ro quiet splash
initrd /boot/initrd.img-2.6.20-15-generic
quiet
savedefault

title Ubuntu, kernel 2.6.20-15-generic (recovery mode)
root (hd0,1)
kernel /boot/vmlinuz-2.6.20-15-generic root=UUID=35d40448-60b4-4625-b6a6-59fa669712fc ro single
initrd /boot/initrd.img-2.6.20-15-generic

title Ubuntu, memtest86+
root (hd0,1)
kernel /boot/memtest86+.bin
quiet

### END DEBIAN AUTOMAGIC KERNELS LIST

# This is a divider, added to separate the menu items below from the Debian
# ones.
title Other operating systems:
root


# This entry automatically added by the Debian installer for a non-linux OS
# on /dev/hda1
title Microsoft Windows XP Professional
root (hd0,0)
savedefault
makeactive
chainloader +1

james@office:~$

[wavemaker]

Re: Start up list.

Thanks for that. Just out of interest I have booted the computer up in all of the kernels. Interesting difference, the ones below the line that says "other operating systems", have a sleeker looking interface when I open Thunderbird or Swiftfox, like it was more modern.

[Qqmike]

Re: Start up list.

Is that all of your menu.lst? is there no more of it?

Back on page 2, you said (I made the corrections involving -15 and -16 as you said):

Ubuntu, kernel 2.6.20-16-generic
Ubuntu, kernel 2.6.20-16-generic (recovery mode)
Ubuntu, kernel 2.6.20-15-generic
Ubuntu, kernel 2.6.20-15-generic (recovery mode)
Ubuntu, memtest86+
Other operating systems:
Microsoft Windows XP Professional
Ubuntu, kernel 2.6.20-16 generic (on /dev/hda2)
Ubuntu, kernel 2.6.20-16-generic (recovery mode) (on /dev/hda2)
Ubuntu, kernel 2.6.20-15-generic (on /dev/hda2)
Ubuntu, kernel 2.6.20-15-generic (on /dev/hda2)
Ubuntu, memtest86+ (on /dev/hda2)

That is NOT what your menu.lst looks like!
The entries after “Other Operating Systems” are NOT showing up in your menu.lst! This makes no sense. I wonder if it’s that d***** Automatix doing this? According to your menu.lst, your “good” Kubuntu is on (hd0,1) = hda2, which is what we thought, and that part is OK.

Again, above, you said:
james@office:~$ sudo fdisk -l
Password:

Disk /dev/hda: 120.0 GB, 120034123776 bytes
255 heads, 63 sectors/track, 14593 cylinders
Units = cylinders of 16065 * 512 = 8225280 bytes

Device Boot Start End Blocks Id System
/dev/hda1 * 1 9013 72396891 7 HPFS/NTFS
/dev/hda2 9014 12251 26009235 83 Linux
/dev/hda3 14266 14593 2634660 5 Extended
/dev/hda4 12252 14265 16177455 83 Linux
/dev/hda5 14360 14593 1879573+ 82 Linux swap / Solaris
/dev/hda6 14266 14359 754992 82 Linux swap / Solaris

OK. I feel pretty certain that you can delete hda4. You would do this using GParted Live CD (see post above for the link). That’s a real handy Live CD to keep on hand. I use it to partition/format everything – internal HDDs, external USB HDDs, thumb drives (or UFDs -- USB Flash Drives). It’s also handy in cases like this, where we want to see exactly what is on your hard drive.

Now, here’s what’s bugging me. It’s very easy in GParted to delete hda4 (highlight it in the list you see in GParted, then Partition > Delete, or press a Delete button on the top menu if it appears there; then say Apply Changes, and off it goes deleting hda4).

But if you want to clean up your HDD, we need more than that done. Here’s how your hard drive should look like:
Device Boot Start End Blocks Id System
/dev/hda1 * 1 9013 72396891 7 HPFS/NTFS (#That’s Windows)
/dev/hda2 9014 12251 26009235 83 Linux (#That’s Kubuntu)
/dev/hda3 14360 14593 1879573+ 82 Linux swap / Solaris (#That’s swap for Kubuntu)
/dev/hda4 14266 14593 2634660 5 Extended (#contains the rest of the un-used disk space)

(You can only have 4 primary partitions on a HDD. had1, had2, had3 makes three of those. So then you create a fourth primary partition called an extended partition and inside the Extended partition you can create more primary partitions but they are now called Logical partitions. So hda5 would be a Logical partition contained within the Extended partition.)

Many people would say that you should also have a separate /home partition for your data in Kubuntu, but let’s not go there right now (it would have to go as a Logical partition within the Extended partition as hda5).

What I don’t know is how to mess with deleting one swap partition and rearranging the other swap partition to be used by your hda2-Kubuntu. We need some help there.

Some people reading this would say:
Leave it all alone, as it is and don’t fret. (I am not one of these people because this doesn’t allow a clean path for future use of the HDD).
Or
Wipe the whole disk (using GParted) and start over from scratch (partition/format with GParted, then re-install Kubuntu).

So, for now:

-- Let’s see if one of the Linux guns here can suggest how to delete the swaps and create one in hda3 for your hda2-Kubuntu without re-installing Kubuntu.

-- Meanwhile, get GParted Live CD.

-- Meanwhile, be happy that you also got Super Grub Disk. It’s used for rescue, repair in case you mess up and can’t boot into Windows and/or Kubuntu or need to fix the GRUB bootloader and so on. When things settle down, take time to play with it: get it into the CD tray and re-boot the PC, then explore the SGD options; experiment with booting your Kubuntu and your Windows using the SGD menus.

-- Meanwhile, let’s find out about that Automatix thing. I’m not in Kubuntu right now. But try to find out if it is installed in your system. Maybe by K-Menu > System > Adept Package Manager, then enter Automatix in the search window and see if it is installed on your system. Removal (using Adept) should be straightforward * as long as it doesn’t mess anything up!*.

-- Keep my How-To handy, too:
How To GRUB Methods - Toolkit
http://kubuntuforums.net/forums/inde...opic=3081671.0
(has lots of handy methods for stuff like we are doing here now)

[Fintan]

Re: Start up list.

What I don’t know is how to mess with deleting one swap partition and rearranging the other swap partition to be used by your hda2-Kubuntu. We need some help there.

try this:

cat /proc/swaps

to find out which swap is being used.

Delete the other

You don't need two swaps, ever.

[Qqmike]

Re: Start up list.

Thanks, Fintan.

So, wavemaker, a feasible, simple option for now would be to
Delete the un-wanted Kubuntu/Linux on hda4.
Delete the un-used swap (follow Fintan's advice -- keep the swap that Kubuntu on hda2 is using; delete the other swap).
Period.
Then catch your breathe.