HELP A POOR CONVERT! I REQUEST A PARDON AND YOUR MERCY!

[MaddOps770]

First off, I'm a new Kubuntu convert. I have a 15 year background in Windows.

One thing I would find helpful is a guide that gives me the lowdown on KDE and Kubuntu as it relates to coming over from Windows. It would be helpful as well to get all of the basic out of the box features that Windows has, when installing Kubuntu (for shortness I'll call it 'K' from here on out). K comes with a wealth of tools. Everything the basic user would need. I use Open Office in Windows as well as K and I love it.

Before we get any farther. Let me give some system specs.
AMD 64 4600+ X2 (64bit Dual Core)
2GB Corsair XMS Memory DDR2-800
BFG 8800GTS OC (320MB)
2 SATA HDDS 1 250G for Winders Veesta, 1 160 for Kubuntu AMD64 7.04
All run on a MSI K9N Diamond SLI Motherboard.

From what I read this should run like a scalded dog with Linux.
I understand Linux OS can run on a multitude of computers. And I am happy for that.
But I find a hard time getting help with the 64 Bit and Higher End Video Card, just short of someone doing a search and pasting the results wich seem to end up as a UBUNTU post for i386.
Now, I don't think I'm wrong here, but I don't think the i386 stuff works on the 64Bit Platform.
At least when I try to install this as directed by such posts, it tells me I'm on the wrong platform.
Or when directed to the IRC, you usually get very low skill level people who have no idea how to help you with your "expensive" hardware.

But in switching over, I need the following features to make it worth doing.

1. Chat program availability. Yep, K has that off the bat.
2. Web Browser. Yep Konqueror is at work.
(But it would be nice to see all websites and not those that don't have flash.)
I don't believe I'm wrong in thinking that I should be able to get to every website the same as I would with IE or Firefox. (And yes I am aware K has Firefox. I'm using it).
3. MP3 Player. Yep K has that too.
4. DVD Playback. It took me almost 8 hours of searching downloading and installing to get one of the *6* programs to play a DVD. VLC was the only one who played the DVD and it still was not as smooth as a regular DVD Player. This is retarded. I understand the legalities, but right now I could care less. The last three pieces of software I paid for were Windows 95 Upgrade, Battlefield 2, and Windows Vista Home Premium Upgrade. I'm not above doing whatever's necessary to get the job done. But I do ask, can y'all get the resources in ONE PLACE for someone to find instead of 15 different websites.
5. Access to the media stored on my NTFS/Windows Hard Drive. If GRUB can find it, why can't K?

I'm not asking for all my games to play. Or any. I'm not even interested in WINE yet. I don't care about themes.
Except on my excursion I did get Beryl and somehow the Gnome Desktop, along with Acrobat Reader and Google Earth, but Picasa wouldn't play along. I don't even give a damn about using *ANY* of my Windows programs under Linux. But I would like to make sure my hardware is working, and I have a GOOD list of repositories for 64Bit stuff to try out different programs with. That seems to be impossible to find. I don't care about stability or security or legality, but I need resources to complete every day tasks.

Also on my mind besides the grand canyon divide between Gnome/Nautulus and KDE/Konqueror, is the ubuntu part the same? It seems they all pull from the same base repository but I'm wanting to make sure I have this right.

I did read the intro on Konqueror, and the Beginners Guide for Kubuntu, but they seem as though they were written for folks who have previous Linux knowledge. But it would be helpful to have "A Guide for the New Windows Convert." Esplainin' Terminal for Folks, the X-Server, apt-get versus using the package managers, etc."
The KDE Documentation made it sound like a GUI interface was something new and scary. What kind of sadist works in nothing in Command Line? XD

I honestly believe Linux will overtake Windows, because MS is trying way to hard anymore. But in Linux there needs to be better documentation for converts, less choices (as in 8 different ways to install a program), and better performance than the store bought apps Windows Users are forced to use. Because I'm all for freedom, but this "try em all, and find your own path" stuff is a little too Buddhist for me . If you want to kill Windows, make it easier for the converts to convert! Honestly if I could have gotten all my stuff running in two days (like us Winders users can) I would have told everyone I know to go away from Windows and get Kubuntu.

This rant is from a place of fustration. What I have expressed are what I think are core pieces of knowledge that need to be placed flat out for anyone taking their first foray into Linux territory. And I did search, but anything more than an hours worth of work for something that takes 10 minutes elsewhere, is not very prudent and something that could stand to be improved.

I'm here for the long haul, but please, I'm imploring you, I need some help.

Jake!

[MepisReign]

Re: HELP A POOR CONVERT! I REQUEST A PARDON AND YOUR MERCY!

Ok Jake:
Lets do the nvidia thingy first:
Open a Konsole -- Click on K menu --> System --> Konsole
Type:
sudo apt-get install nvidia-glx-new
That will download and install the latest Nvidia driver. Now, we need to know that is correctly configured.
Reboot...
There open and Konsole again and type:
sudo kate /etc/X11/xorg.conf
Look for "Device" and replace "nv" with "nvidia". If is already replaced don't do anything further. Save the file, by clicking on Save.
Reboot....
Again open a Konsole and type:
sudo nvidia-settings
There make the changes that you need and then click on "Save" and then "Save to X Configuration file"
Reboot.....Done

Now if you are interested in codecs, multimedia stuff and so on I would suggest Automatix, you can find more info here ----> http://www.getautomatix.com/wiki/ind...e=Installation

Please let us now how everything went

Greetz

MepisReign

[MaddOps770]

Re: HELP A POOR CONVERT! I REQUEST A PARDON AND YOUR MERCY!

Step One: No Problem.

Reboot. Select Kernel 2.16 (Normal) Everything is black.
Reboot, again. Select Kernel 2.16 (recovery)
Enter Command to Edit File in Konsole. Get a lot of errors. Then Kate Pops Up.
I change both instances of boardname and device from nv to nvidia.
Reboot, again. Everything is still black. (No Login Screen).
Reboot, again. Try Recovery Mode. That's all black too.

So Now I'm back in Vista writing to you.

But on the upside it did say that my device was the G80 [8800GTS]

So what do I do now?

MR, Thanks for your help. I do appreciate it.

[MepisReign]

Re: HELP A POOR CONVERT! I REQUEST A PARDON AND YOUR MERCY!

Well I don't think that changing the board name have too much to do but try just changing the nv with nvidia.
On the errors displayed before kate opens don't worry.
On the other hand you could try by removing everything named nvidia on Adept and installing just nvidia-glx-new.
That should work unless there's a bug or something. My knowledge is still limited but I will do my best to give you a hand on this.

Greetz

MepisReign

[MaddOps770]

Re: HELP A POOR CONVERT! I REQUEST A PARDON AND YOUR MERCY!

Thanks for the help. Temporarily I'm locked out of the OS because I can see the Harddrive Light blinking but can't get a prompt or a login screen. And I've left it to sit that way for a while. Hmm. I'm puzzled.

[jankushka]

Re: HELP A POOR CONVERT! I REQUEST A PARDON AND YOUR MERCY!

this might help: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/
this in particular: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Sw...tu/FromWindows
i don't know what's in these pages.
i've never read them, 'cause i've never had to switch from anything
hopefully, you'll find something useful in there.

now your questions...

1. (gnome) ubuntu vs (kde) kubuntu vs (xfce) xubuntu (any) *buntu
the os is the same.
just different desktop environments.
ubuntu uses gnome, kubuntu uses kde, xubuntu uses xfce, and there are/will be others...
but all applications run everywhere, 'cause, as said, the os is the same.
it's a matter of freedom and choice.
yeah, yeah, i know...you're just not used to it.
but it's not all that bad, you know... 8)

2. command line vs gui
in general...
in linux, guis are just front ends to command line tools (often you have different gui but same backends)
so, you'll always have that choice.
for people who don't know anything, the gui is alright.
for me, 99% of the times command line is just more powerful and faster.
it's also true that guis don't always have all the functionalities of the backend tools implemented.
that's why, especially when things go wrong, you'll often be asked to run some os command.

3. installing apps
kubuntu is based on debian which uses the apt system for software management.
here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Advanced_Packaging_Tool
use adept (i use synaptic, 'cause i like it better) for all the linux specific stuff.
use automatix for all the non linux specific stuff (ff, thunderbird, skype, eclipse, adobe, googleearth, drivers, ... you name it).
applications get installed (and are kept up to date!) with just a couple of clicks.
not even windoze can do that so efficiently.
especially when it comes to removing stuff and you want to be (reasonably) sure your system is clean.
anyway...here: http://www.getautomatix.com/wiki/ind...e=Installation

4. Chat program availability. Yep, K has that off the bat.
kopete is kde's multiprotocol chat app.
one app, all chat protocols.
it should be good enough.

5. Web Browser. Yep Konqueror is at work...
konqueror is a great app. it's a bit picky, though.
mind you, it likes web pages to be syntactically correct and stuff like that.
so, use firefox.
be aware though that (this) world (whether we like it or not) still revolves around windoze.
so, there'll be stuff you won't be able to see.
it's also true that it's always all stuff you can go without.

6. MP3 Player. Yep K has that too.
yeah, the most popular kde apps here must be amarok.
which also drives your ipod and the like.
you might also want to rip and burn cds...then your app is k3b.

7. DVD Playback. It took me almost 8 hours of searching downloading and installing to get...
simply 'cause linux is new to you.
it takes me no more than 5 minutes to get all the necessary stuff for dvd playback.
your answer here is (again) automatix.
what application to use...don't know...what about mplayer?

8. Access to the media stored on my NTFS/Windows Hard Drive. If GRUB can find it, why can't K?
linux supports ntfs no problems.
i'd actually venture to say that linux supports ntfs better than windoze.
your packages are:
ntfs-3g for ntfs support
ntfsprogs for the tools for when windoze screws things and an operating system is needed to fix them (and windoze doesn't have those off the bat!)

9. If you want to kill Windows, make it easier for the converts to convert...
i can't speak for the others, but i couldn't care less about killing windoze.
i'm very happy with how things are right now.
as you say...it's about freedom.
which includes the freedom to use windoze if that's what works for you.

10. better applications' performance, better time to production, ...
in general...
i can install a basic linux system in 43 minutes clocked.
if you know what you're doing, there's no comparison.
the last time i had to install windows xp (it actually was the first and the last time i've ever done that) it was 'cause my sister asked me to.
it took me 3 days and had to start everything from scratch twice.
the first time the system wouldn't boot for a corrupted i don't know what file.
the next time i couldn't install the antivirus quick enough and 30seconds after configuring the net interface, the system was screwed...
it took me so much probably because (despite my 20+ year experience with computers) i had never installed a windoze system before and only heard about it.

very often people speak about the quality and performance of gnu/linux because things don't
work or work but aren't as fast as they expect them to be...
the real issue is that whatever device out there comes with a driver and support for windoze.
but it's not always so for linux.
we often rely on standards and on reverse engineering.
how much vendors stick to standards we all know and reverse engineering isn't always easy.
especially when things are changed just to make your (support) life difficult.
products by vendors that do have open source drivers and that do provide the necessary internals, work just as well in linux.

the growth of linux is an exponential function.
we're still kinda down at the bottom at the moment.
but it'll take off.
it's just a matter of time.

---
hth

PS:
btw, after a year of suffering, my sister now runs xubuntu.
she is very happy with it.
my little nephew (i should have taped him) actually said:
"finally a system i can use without being a computer expert".

[MaddOps770]

Re: HELP A POOR CONVERT! I REQUEST A PARDON AND YOUR MERCY!

jankushka, thanks for your help and insight.

I do appreciate it. I first tried using Vector Linux, Mandrake (before it was called Mandriva) and Knoppix, plus Phlak about 5 years ago. On an OLD OLD Laptop. Judging by Kubuntu, it's come a long long way.

I don't mind using Konsole or the Command Line to do what I need done. I've been told apt-get is the best because it will get other packages (if needed) when you don't have all the pre-requisites in place.

I tried MPlayer but the playback was choppy and green. Bummer.

Thanks again. I'm off and reading.

[dibl]

Re: HELP A POOR CONVERT! I REQUEST A PARDON AND YOUR MERCY!

When you see the "all black" screen upon attempting to boot, is there a blinking white "_" in the upper left corner? If so, give it Alt-F1, or Ctrl-Alt-F1, and it will switch to a console with a login prompt. Login there, and then execute the command

startx

It won't start, but it will show you the error that is causing the xserver not to start. Probably you have multiple nvida kernel modules, and one will have to be removed. Try it and post the results, and you'll get help.

[MepisReign]

Re: HELP A POOR CONVERT! I REQUEST A PARDON AND YOUR MERCY!

There u go MaddOps770, I was just waiting for reinforcements

MepisReign

[jankushka]

Re: HELP A POOR CONVERT! I REQUEST A PARDON AND YOUR MERCY!

...Judging by Kubuntu, it's come a long long way...

it did.

I don't mind using Konsole or the Command Line to do what I need done. I've been told apt-get is the best because it will get other packages (if needed) when you don't have all the pre-requisites in place.

provided you have all the repositories in your repositories file set up alright, yeah, it's like that.
actually, making sure my /etc/apt/sources.list file is alright is always the first thing i do when the system boots after installation.

I tried MPlayer but the playback was choppy and green. Bummer.

as you've tried a few apps and the playback is still not satisfactory,
then maybe it's the dvd player which is not driven properly.
but, i'd say...one thing at a time.
graphics first.
then the rest.

you'll find people that'll help you with everything.
and hopefully you'll have a decently running system in a couple of days... 8)

[MaddOps770]

Re: HELP A POOR CONVERT! I REQUEST A PARDON AND YOUR MERCY!

When you see the "all black" screen upon attempting to boot, is there a blinking white "_" in the upper left corner? If so, give it Alt-F1, or Ctrl-Alt-F1, and it will switch to a console with a login prompt. Login there, and then execute the command

startx

It won't start, but it will show you the error that is causing the xserver not to start. Probably you have multiple nvida kernel modules, and one will have to be removed. Try it and post the results, and you'll get help.

I'll have to try that. Thanks.

[dibl]

Re: HELP A POOR CONVERT! I REQUEST A PARDON AND YOUR MERCY!

If my dismal prediction turns out to be correct (i.e. the infamous nvidia kernel mismatch error), here is the sequence that should get you back to happy:

From the console (aka Command Line Interface or CLI), or character mode terminal for noobs like you and me:

sudo apt-get --purge remove nvidia-glx nvidia-glx-new nvidia-kernel-common nvidia-settings

sudo rm /etc/init.d/nvidia-*

sudo apt-get install nvidia-glx-new linux-restricted-modules-`uname -r`

Upon getting a satisfactory result (no errors noticed) from that series of commands, then give it this one:

sudo shutdown now -r

And then if all goes well, your system will come up with a green and black Nvidia splash screen immediately prior to presenting you the GUI login screen.

I'm crossing my fingers now ....

[MaddOps770]

Re: HELP A POOR CONVERT! I REQUEST A PARDON AND YOUR MERCY!

Yeah, I think I'm in re-install territory. I can't get ANYTHING to come up.

Kubuntu makes the baby Jake cry.

[dibl]

Re: HELP A POOR CONVERT! I REQUEST A PARDON AND YOUR MERCY!

We'll just consider the first attempt your "practice run".

Now, try installing Kubuntu again, and if there are video issues, you'll have this thread to refer to!

[MaddOps770]

Re: HELP A POOR CONVERT! I REQUEST A PARDON AND YOUR MERCY!

Actually it's my 4th run. Ubuntu, and 3 Kubuntu installs.
Turns out my original "blackout" problems were due to the fact that I couldn't use DVI and Had to run an adapter and use my Flat Panel in Analog mode.

Why am I hearing Whitesnakes Here I Go Again.....

lD