Should Ubuntu switch it's default DE to KDE?

[Calixte]

Hey!
I'm a fan of KDE 4, and while I'm more and more impressed by it, I'm kind of dispapointed that Canonical doesn't want to make it Ubuntu's default DE. I've written an article on TechHaze about why I think it should be so and why I believe it's important. You can find it here. Please comment on it and tell me what you think here or there (and don't forget to vote on the poll)
Thanks for reading,
Calixte

[Snowhog]

Re: Should Ubuntu switch it's default DE to KDE?

Why in the world would Canonical want to do that!? Ubuntu is Gnome - period. That is their business model Mark Shuttleworth opted for. Nothing wrong with that at all.

It is interesting to note however, that Mark Shuttleworth became the first ever Patron of KDE, which clearly shows (at least then) his commitment to the development of KDE as a viable Desktop Environment.

[Calixte]

Re: Should Ubuntu switch it's default DE to KDE?

I just believe that the reasons that Ubuntu had for using GNOME are outdated, and that KDE is simply the bet desktop since the KDE4 version became stable.

[Snowhog]

Re: Should Ubuntu switch it's default DE to KDE?

Nothing wrong with ones 'personal' point of view.

Gnome is a very mature DE. While many don't likes it's utilitarian look - I don't either - it suites many, else it wouldn't have the popularity that it does.

[GreyGeek]

Re: Should Ubuntu switch it's default DE to KDE?

My view is that Kubuntu is Shuttlesworth's "fall back position" in the event that MONO turns out to be the trap MOST of the community believes it to be. That's why, except for Ubuntu & Novell, MONO is not taking off in the other distros.

[Snowhog]

Re: Should Ubuntu switch it's default DE to KDE?

That's why, except for Ubuntu & Novell, MONO is not taking off in the other distros.

They're all waiting to see if Mark took the "blue pill" or the "red pill".

Can you imagine though, what Kubuntu could become, if it had the financial backing the Ubuntu gets?

[Calixte]

Re: Should Ubuntu switch it's default DE to KDE?

Can you imagine though, what Kubuntu could become, if it had the financial backing the Ubuntu gets?

+1

[askrieger]

Re: Should Ubuntu switch it's default DE to KDE?

The wonderful thing about Linux (as distinct from proprietary operating systems) is that you can do what YOU want to do. Some people, including Mark Shuttleworth (but not me), like the Gnome desktop environment. Others don't. Mark had the vision to recognise this. Accordingly, he included the capacity to use other desktop environments in his (primary) vision of a fork of Debian with scheduled releases. Personally, I'm delighted that he did so. He could have kept his distro restricted to Gnome without provision for other desktops environments.

I still hate Gnome, but XFCE is looking interesting.

[Snowhog]

Re: Should Ubuntu switch it's default DE to KDE?

I still hate Gnome, but XFCE is looking interesting.

For me, Gnome just sort of 'sits' there, where as KDE, well, 'pops' if you know what I mean. Gnome just doesn't have any 'eye' appeal, and I don't mean eye candy - Compiz provides that. To me, Gnome looks flat, while KDE has depth.

[Calixte]

Re: Should Ubuntu switch it's default DE to KDE?

The wonderful thing about Linux (as distinct from proprietary operating systems) is that you can do what YOU want to do. Some people, including Mark Shuttleworth (but not me), like the Gnome desktop environment. Others don't. Mark had the vision to recognise this. Accordingly, he included the capacity to use other desktop environments in his (primary) vision of a fork of Debian with scheduled releases. Personally, I'm delighted that he did so. He could have kept his distro restricted to Gnome without provision for other desktops environments.

Of course, and I respect that. What makes Linux the best kernel is choice, and I wouldn't trade it in for anything. I don't think GNOME should be abandoned. What I'd like to see, however, is a Canonical that works as much on Making Kubuntu great than they work on improving GNOME right now.
http://techhaze.com/2010/05/ubuntu-with-a-k/

[DeathKitten]

Re: Should Ubuntu switch it's default DE to KDE?

I still hate Gnome, but XFCE is looking interesting.

For me, Gnome just sort of 'sits' there, where as KDE, well, 'pops' if you know what I mean. Gnome just doesn't have any 'eye' appeal, and I don't mean eye candy - Compiz provides that. To me, Gnome looks flat, while KDE has depth.

KDE wins for me because I can fluff everything the way I want it so easily. If you look at the interface on both of my computers, the thing people will most often comment on first is how clean and uncluttered everything is. My panels are small, they only have the bare minimum they need for me to be functional, and my window decorations are as tiny as I can practically get them. I could probably make gnome functional if I wanted, but I just remember it being such a pain in the rear to work with, and I've gotten used to KDE over the years I've been using it.

While I would like kubuntu to get more of the spot light, I understand how big of an upset and change in the ubuntu community it would be to switch the primary focus from the gnome to kde desktop. The two are just such different beasts on the inside that they require different points of view just to work with. It's just not practical. A better alternative would be convincing Shuttleworth that kubuntu is worth drawing more focus to, as KDE is such a rich environment, and drawing in KDE users to the ubuntu family would just help us all grow and expand.

[MoonRise]

Re: Should Ubuntu switch it's default DE to KDE?

I still hate Gnome, but XFCE is looking interesting. Smiley

+1

Can you imagine though, what Kubuntu could become, if it had the financial backing the Ubuntu gets?

+1

[GreyGeek]

Re: Should Ubuntu switch it's default DE to KDE?

The wonderful thing about Linux (as distinct from proprietary operating systems) is that you can do what YOU want to do.

It depends. IF a distro uses GRUB or LILO and calls inittab, which sets the run level and the spawning devices, then calls /etc/profile or bashrc, which sets up console login screen, and from there the home account profile and/or bashrc, which calls startkde ... then I can do what I want. I log into root and setup the printers, screen resolution, wireless/network, etc. That includes mounting and unmounting removable storage, etc. (Sound familiar? Distros, about 3 or 4 years ago.)

Now, with GRUB2, HAL or upstart, link redirections, and so much stuff compiled into the kernel, today's distro is, for me, a mixed bag. I LOVE how Lucid Lynx does so much automatically and wouldn't go back to the way things were, except for GRUB2 - in which I cannot see in advantage over GRUB, and the lack of an xserver configuration tool like XFdrake. (I actually solved a problem with my video acceleration by using a PCLOS 2010 LiveCD and XFdrake to create an xorg.conf file, which I copied to my system. It fixed my problem.) I found it very discouraging when they took out the -high option from the dpgk video config option. I appreciate the automatic "out of the box" setup, but it doesn't work for all hardware, and for those instances video setup programs are necessary.

.....
I still hate Gnome, but XFCE is looking interesting.

From my POV, Gnome and XFCE have the same shortcoming: lack of a sufficient mime connectivity ... the links between a file type and the application which can manipulate it.

[lcorken]

Re: Should Ubuntu switch it's default DE to KDE?

When we went to KDE 4.0 a few jumped from the good ship KDE to Gnome.

If and When Ubuntu goes to Gnome 3.0, it would be interesting to see how many Gnomers jump off that ship.
http://brainstorm.ubuntu.com/idea/20576/ Interesting read.

Ken.

[GreyGeek]

Re: Should Ubuntu switch it's default DE to KDE?

Interesting read.

He touts KDE4 "clean" design which, he says, is leading to rapid development. My POV is that Qt4 deserves part of that praise. It is a very clean and well thought out API, and heavily documented. KDE4 is, essentially, C++, Qt4 and the KDE dev crew. One zip file download gets you the WHOLE skd. All you add is the g++ compiler and the gdb debugger. Autoconf and cmake are optional be recommended. Over all a very clean dev tool, and it has been from the start.

He contrasts that with GNOME3 design, which he says is scattering left and right and bringing in all sorts of languages and tools. He predicts that GNOME3 will "kill Ubuntu". He fails to remember that in order to develop for GNOME using the GTK+ one needs to download tools from, at my last count, six different projects, each with their own development schedule, and the GTK+ development doesn't "come together" until all six tools synchronize their versions to the version of GTK+. Other tools have similar problems: Eclipse, various Java IDE's, Ruby, etc.. By now, someone may have combined all those GTK+ precursor tools into one downloadable file, but GTK+ is a real hybrid creature. The C language, which DOES NOT have OOP intrinsically, so one cannot do true polymorphism or inheritance cleanly without lots of putzing, is what GTK+ is coded with.

One only has to compare the "Signal & Slot" technology of Qt4 with that of GTK+/Gnome to see the difference in cleanness. With a single line of code, using the built in "connect" function, I can connect an "action" or "even" (menu, button, mouse, etc..) with one or more functions that handle it. With a "disconnect" command I can turn the action off, do something that would have normally triggered it, and then turn it on again with "connect". Here is an example of the code that does that sort of thing, taken from the time-records application I wrote at work before I retired:

....
Qry = "select TO_CHAR(endingperiod,'MM/dd/yyyy') as PERIODEND, endingperiod ";
Qry.append(" from timerecs where empid = ");
Qry.append(cempid);
Qry.append(" order by endingperiod desc");
empData->exec(Qry);
if (empData->first()){
if (empData->isValid()){
//disconnect signal for change of ending period
disconnect(ui.cboEndingPeriod, SIGNAL(currentIndexChanged(int)), 0, 0);
ui.cboEndingPeriod->clear();
this->endingperiodlist << empData->value(0).toString();
deEndDate = empData->value(1).toDate();
ui.lblPeriodend->setText(empData->value(0).toString());
while (empData->next()){
this->endingperiodlist << empData->value(0).toString();
};
ui.cboPrintDate->addItems( endingperiodlist );
ui.cboEndingPeriod->addItems( endingperiodlist );
// reconnect signal for change of ending period
connect(ui.cboEndingPeriod, SIGNAL(currentIndexChanged(int)), this, SLOT(displayTSinfo( int )));
fetchTimeFields(deEndDate, cempid);
populateAbsenceView(deEndDate, cempid);
} else {
ui.lblPeriodend->setText("");
statusBar()->showMessage("No valid data available!);
}
}
...

The code fetches all the records for the selected pay period, along with the absence information, for an employee, and displays the data in a grid format for perusal or printing. Normally, programatically changing the "Ending Period" on the date field of the screen (ui.cboEndingPeriod) will trigger a refetch leading to a race condition. Shutting off the signal/slot connection disables the action.