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    Woes of KDE 4.2 it is dead to me... Linus is right!

    I was pretty excited about the whole process of switching from XP or Vista to desktop Linux, tried Gnome 32-bit, Kubuntu 32-bit and 64-bit, after a month of spending on average of 15 hours a week attempting to repair things that broke or drivers to install I gotta say now that I have lost my desktop setting again for the 28th time I am just fed up with fixing the same problems over and over again.

    I attempted to upgrade to the .11 kernel again lost all my settings related to the Nvidia 180.22 driver working, lost my X-Fi audio again even though it does see the card just asks if I want to forget it and never try to install it again, had to re setup my xorg.conf again (I must have edited this file alone 300 times) removing the network manager in KDE actually improved my network performance after manually editing the files, on and on and on.... I could write 20 more pages of all I did to make it a stable place to conduct real work but it's just not stable this including a fresh install of 4.2 x64.

    Tried to use 32-bit Kubuntu on my XPS Dell laptop this is my back up machine as soon as I started to work on getting the desktop settings setup I ended up getting a white desktop and having to re setup the desktop from scratch, what did I do, I clicked the Desktop Effects button and clicked apply, that's all, White desktop again, and going to the prompt to repair or remove the setting file I edited.

    Firefox and Thunderbird mail well if you turn on GTK setting under the appearance and use the Raleigh or the whatever it is called setting in the sub menu you actually get XP like performance for Firefox and Thunderbird if you don't use this and let the default setting continue to manage the look of these programs you will get the worst performing Firefox in the history of mankind, slow enough that you can watch the screen rebuilding itself, seems that it KDE 4.2 normal settings conflict with the normal rendering of both these apps, if you let the GTK libs render the screen you are in better shape unless you are using a custom window color setting for KDE and skin for Firefox like Abstract Classic my normal for all op systems, I get a nice Zebra look where it seems half rendered by the skinner and some of KDE in there, my favorite part of figuring this out, is that the settings will not stay so every time I reboot I need to go back in the appearance and switch back to default, then switch back to GTK then use the sub option again so I can get the apply button so actually surf the web, or check my email with a good frame rate, also if you do this enough you will remove the KDE manager's ability during that session only to skin the windows so you get GTK version of the window which performs well but doesn't look like any of the other windows on the desktop.



    CD burning seemed to work well, DVD playback after spending a few hours locating the proper files to install worked but comparing it to viewing the same movie on the same hardware under vista or xp or KDE I just found the experience to be less on KDE overall.

    Amarok compared to WinAmp, its ok works fine has a lot of default streamed audio stations that I remove so I can find what I am looking for easier.

    WINE 1.14 seems to have broken what I had working before using 1.13 and .12 I have just given up on WINE at this point, if I fix the rest of the problems I am having with the Nvidia drivers with the new kernel maybe it will work again.

    Grub Kernel entry missing after upgrade, I had to manually add it to the grub boot menu to get it to show up, I cannot make it the default setting I have to manually select it every time.

    IM client Kopate compared to trillian, well if you spend some time changing enough options it is decent, unless you want to transfer files to a non Kopate user, seems to struggle in the same way that trillian does, just more people I know use trillian so it is easier over all for me.

    Adapt is a pretty pile of crap compared to Snaptetic.

    Network bug on the last tab, you get the .xml error when clicking on the tab, this was broken before the final release and still seems to be broken, sure you can search the web find what to hack in to make it work but again broken on release means someone just didn't click a button, so no testing.

    I feel like I have gone back 20 years in time and have become a tester for code, and tools that have seemed to have very little testing overall. My recommendation is to have the devs broadcast what they are actually using what should be avoided every release, a master list of what they had loaded when they decided to add code to the branch so aren't guessing, looking for what you really need to install in the vast pile of options even if you know what you are looking for can waste hours, and break your system. Its the wild west of software, the overall result seems to take away from the core concept of what linux should be something stable and useful for work.

    Well these are my notes so far, I will reread this post and attempt to fix all the type o's and grammar errors, once I become less angry that I am stuck with XP for any useful development work.







    #2
    Re: Woes of KDE 4.2 it is dead to me... Linus is right!

    i know how you feel.
    i've told these kubuntu folks several times not to publish experimental code.
    that people will install it on their production systems.
    that it's bad for kde.
    it's just not a good marketing strategy.
    ...
    but they won't listen.

    gnu/linux is not windoze

    Comment


      #3
      Re: Woes of KDE 4.2 it is dead to me... Linus is right!

      I've installed Hardy Heron on my laptop, just to check out, why people hated 4.2. And I really know now. KDE 3.5 is so much more sable than 4.1 (I know 4.2 is easily installed, but if you're trying out Intrepid you might dump Kubuntu because of KDE 4.1). I'd really hope they would make KDE 3.5 available for 8.10 (or 9.04).
      Kubuntu 8.04.1 Hardy Heron KDE 3.5.9 @ Lenovo 3000 N200, Intel Pentium Dual-Core 1,86 GHz, Intel X3100 onboard, 2 GB RAM, 160 GB HDD<br />Kubuntu 8.10 Intrepid Ibex x86_64 4.2 @ AMD Athlon 64 X2 4000 +, ASUS GeForce 8600 GT, 4 GB Corsair 800 MHz RAM, Seagate 320 HDD, LG 19&quot; TFT, L192WS-SN

      Comment


        #4
        Re: Woes of KDE 4.2 it is dead to me... Linus is right!

        As a matter of fact, they won't ever do that... Actually they are against that for the simple reason that it'd take longer to develop a brand new OS with a brand new GUI and they only have about 6 months to do it...
        Multibooting: Kubuntu Noble 24.04
        Before: Jammy 22.04, Focal 20.04, Precise 12.04 Xenial 16.04 and Bionic 18.04
        Win XP, 7 & 10 sadly
        Using Linux since June, 2008

        Comment


          #5
          Re: Woes of KDE 4.2 it is dead to me... Linus is right!

          Well if they only have 6 months to finish this OS, and aren't willing to attach manifest file with what they are running during check in's then my hopes of using the OS in any serious way drop to almost 0%, it is then just a toy. I doubt they did all this work for years though to throw all away after 6 months from now.

          KDE is nice icing on the cake but the cake itself is made with a layer of poop in it.

          Comment


            #6
            Re: Woes of KDE 4.2 it is dead to me... Linus is right!

            Hmm. So KDE 4.2 isn't every bodies cup of tea. I like it, and it works for me (and for many others as well). But I also continue to keep 8.04 w/KDE 3.5.10 on my laptop, even though 8.10 running KDE 4.2.00 is my main OS.

            Linux is all about choices. The fact that KDE 4.2 doesn't fair for some doesn't mean that it was a bad direction for the developers to have chosen to go in.
            Windows no longer obstructs my view.
            Using Kubuntu Linux since March 23, 2007.
            "It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data." - Sherlock Holmes

            Comment


              #7
              Re: Woes of KDE 4.2 it is dead to me... Linus is right!

              I doubt they did all this work for years though to throw all away after 6 months from now.
              You are missing the point.

              The OS is on different level than the desktop.

              You can choose the desktop you wish and be done with it. Period.

              Or be a part of...

              Yes I read your misgivings about kde4.

              Having said that it may have been helpful to yourself and others if you would post the specs to your machine.

              No one said at any time it was the holy grail but for me it works fine very fine.
              HP Pavilion dv6 core i7 (Main)
              4 GB Ram
              Kubuntu 18.10

              Comment


                #8
                Re: Woes of KDE 4.2 it is dead to me... Linus is right!

                ops, wrong thread (to many tabs on the browser ) meant for this thread, sorry about that.
                ASUS M4A87TD | AMD Ph II x6 | 12 GB ram | MSI GeForce GTX 560 Ti (448 Cuda cores)
                Kubuntu 12.04 KDE 4.9.x (x86_64) - Debian "Squeeze" KDE 4.(5x) (x86_64)
                Acer TimelineX 4820 TG | intel i3 | 4 GB ram| ATI Radeon HD 5600
                Kubuntu 12.10 KDE 4.10 (x86_64) - OpenSUSE 12.3 KDE 4.10 (x86_64)
                - Officially free from windoze since 11 dec 2009
                >>>>>>>>>>>> Support KFN <<<<<<<<<<<<<

                Comment


                  #9
                  Re: Woes of KDE 4.2 it is dead to me... Linus is right!

                  To the guys that responded: Just please note I wanted this to work better then XP or Vista or Xp-x64 or Red Hat or Gnome, so I could use it for real work, I liked what I was seeing, and my issues above are just the surface problems. Today for some reason I got my MBR corrupted and had to remove grub to fix it so I could boot back into XP my main work environment. Recovery of Grub gets a -10 on easy of use, should be as simple as boot with the Live CD and select the option to recover what I can see already did work.

                  My Hardware spec is focused on bang for the buck, and follows the mobo and proc were purchased the video card was given to me, once they make a card that render Crysis at 1900x1200 at 60FPS I will upgrade again until then I don't see the point or if Intel's or AMD/ATI or even Nvidia's future work provides a video card-less solution in the next few years or so with a 64 core proc I will go in that direction, at this point I know video cards are going away in the next few years I might be able to get one more cycle before they are a memory.



                  Mainboard : EVGA 132-CK-NF78
                  Chipset : nVidia nForce 780i SLI SPP
                  Processor : Intel Core 2 Duo E8400 @ 3000 MHz (overclocked 3.712 air cooled)
                  Physical Memory : 4096 MB (4 x 1024 DDR2-SDRAM )
                  Video Card : NVIDIA GeForce 8800 GTX ULTRA
                  Hard Disk : HDS72505 (500 GB)
                  Hard Disk : WDC (1000 GB)
                  DVD-Rom Drive : PLEXTOR DVDR PX-716A
                  Monitor Type : (2)x Dell Computer DELL 2405FPW - 24 inches
                  Device Audio : Sound Blaster X-Fi


                  180.22 Nvidia Driver, KDE 4.2 with the x64 install


                  I am really trying to become a fan of this community and support the OS, the help from everyone has been great with out it I would have given up almost as soon as I started, my issue is with the devs that do not seem to test the code they are releasing, it leaves a bad taste in the users mouth, once that happens they won't try it again, not for a long time if ever which hurts the overall goal of making a Linux based OS that is for normal people to use.

                  My next task is to try Win7 beta, the finished version of Vista which still looks slower in BETA then XP on many tasks but might over take it when finished.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Re: Woes of KDE 4.2 it is dead to me... Linus is right!

                    Originally posted by jankushka
                    i know how you feel.
                    i've told these kubuntu folks several times not to publish experimental code.
                    that people will install it on their production systems.
                    that it's bad for kde.
                    it's just not a good marketing strategy.
                    ...
                    but they won't listen.
                    Its the users who don't listen. Surely somewhere between the bold "do not install on production systems" and "EXPERIMENTAL" the stupid user should have grasped that its not rock solid yet.

                    Besides...if they don't publish "experimental" code/alphas/betas, then who is going to test it and find the bugs?

                    My next task is to try Win7 beta,
                    Careful with your MP3s. Win7 is know to damage them (cuts off a few sec from the file). Being beta software & all that... And the beta is dying soon afaik: MS built in kill switch.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Re: Woes of KDE 4.2 it is dead to me... Linus is right!

                      Originally posted by HavocXphere
                      Its the users who don't listen. Surely somewhere between the bold "do not install on production systems" and "EXPERIMENTAL" the stupid user should have grasped that its not rock solid yet.

                      Besides...if they don't publish "experimental" code/alphas/betas, then who is going to test it and find the bugs?
                      thought it was clear my post was sarcastic.
                      guess it wasn't clear enough.
                      gnu/linux is not windoze

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Re: Woes of KDE 4.2 it is dead to me... Linus is right!

                        ok so i hear a lot of things being said here that just don't make sence...
                        first off your "white screen" has NOTHING to do w/ kde4 (thats what happens when you try to turn on composite rendering w/o driver support)
                        i would go so far to say that improper installed video drivers are the cause of most of your gui woes...,

                        the big problem w/ kde4 that its NOT kde3 and still a WIP. (idk if ne one remember kde3.2 and how much is was not great)
                        and because of that almost everthing has to be rewritten (at least kde wise) to support kde4 from the ground up or else you are still relying on the kde3 libs and thats gonna cost you proformance.

                        Mark Your Solved Issues [SOLVED]
                        (top of thread: thread tools)

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Re: Woes of KDE 4.2 it is dead to me... Linus is right!

                          Originally posted by HavocXphere
                          Originally posted by jankushka
                          i know how you feel.
                          i've told these kubuntu folks several times not to publish experimental code.
                          that people will install it on their production systems.
                          that it's bad for kde.
                          it's just not a good marketing strategy.
                          ...
                          but they won't listen.
                          Its the users who don't listen. Surely somewhere between the bold "do not install on production systems" and "EXPERIMENTAL" the stupid user should have grasped that its not rock solid yet.

                          Besides...if they don't publish "experimental" code/alphas/betas, then who is going to test it and find the bugs?

                          My next task is to try Win7 beta,
                          Careful with your MP3s. Win7 is know to damage them (cuts off a few sec from the file). Being beta software & all that... And the beta is dying soon afaik: MS built in kill switch.
                          Yeah a title like 4.2 Beta sort of indicates BETA, when the same bugs remained in the "Final" version and I reinstalled clean to avoid problems you would think they would have fixed some of the things people were reporting months before they said it was finished.

                          Win7 Beta is on a different box, on its own drive, since I avoided Vista all together this is my time to try everything to see if I am staying with XP pro for another few years. I am not worried about mp3 corruption as I will transfer them from master Mp3 HD repository, and everyone knows about the kill switch, they moved up the ship date since its getting good hype. The beta is more solid then the shipping for version of KDE 4.2 but hey this is something you are going to have to pay for instead of getting for free so as they say you get what you pay for.





                          Comment


                            #14
                            Re: Woes of KDE 4.2 it is dead to me... Linus is right!

                            Originally posted by sithlord48
                            ok so i hear a lot of things being said here that just don't make sence...
                            first off your "white screen" has NOTHING to do w/ kde4 (thats what happens when you try to turn on composite rendering w/o driver support)
                            i would go so far to say that improper installed video drivers are the cause of most of your gui woes...,

                            the big problem w/ kde4 that its NOT kde3 and still a WIP. (idk if ne one remember kde3.2 and how much is was not great)
                            and because of that almost everthing has to be rewritten (at least kde wise) to support kde4 from the ground up or else you are still relying on the kde3 libs and thats gonna cost you proformance.

                            White screen happened before I installed the drivers, I just clicked on Desktop effects and attempted to turn them on, the white screen was easy to fix I just had to delete the newly changed files and restarted X and it came back, losing the task bar 30+ times and having to delete all the .kde settings so I could get it back to default sucked.

                            Once everything was all setup I got decent performance not XP but better then most other things, the problem was I had no stability, I can beat on XP all day and night compiling code, working in maya, and other things that destroy memory, it just wasn't the case in the KDE 4.2 version of Ubuntu.

                            I am running Ubuntu x64 with Compiz-Fusion Emerald, its has already proven to be more solid then KDE 4.2.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Re: Woes of KDE 4.2 it is dead to me... Linus is right!

                              Originally posted by jankushka
                              Originally posted by HavocXphere
                              Its the users who don't listen. Surely somewhere between the bold "do not install on production systems" and "EXPERIMENTAL" the stupid user should have grasped that its not rock solid yet.

                              Besides...if they don't publish "experimental" code/alphas/betas, then who is going to test it and find the bugs?
                              thought it was clear my post was sarcastic.
                              guess it wasn't clear enough.
                              Nope made you look like a BIG Flappy Dick... oh that came out wrong see forum humor never works had I said this to you in person you would know for sure I am kidding, and be lol.

                              Oh and finally this thread can be locked I think it is a good tail for new users of KDE 4.2 so they dont feel that it is just them that are having troubles. Since I have dumped KDE for now I wont be back to this forum for a while, good luck with your Alpha testing.

                              Comment

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