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    The Ease of Windows Vs the Hardness of Linux

    Don't be upset of the subject, cause am going to end the sentence with, "The stability & reliability of Linux Vs the Crashability & bugginess of Windows."

    I quit get the idea that I'm going to be attacked if I wrote this subject without justifying why did I wrote it, specially that am writing it in one of the most famous Linux distros forum :P

    But let's be honest, as I understand, Ubuntu means Linux for humans, well, let me get that straight, it's not for all humans "yet"
    As I switched from Windows to Linux, installed Ubuntu as default OS, I have to say, you have to be somewhat technical to solve your problems.
    You have to be familiar with CLI to solve lot's of issue's, unlike Windows, where everything is GUI.
    Of course, many people would feel like killing me when I talk sweet about Windows, but lets face it. It is easier for a person to install things on Windows.
    I myself had enormous trouble trying to activate RAID 0 using Linux I failed to do so. Installing the NVIDIA drivers in the wrong way crashed my GUI & my system would work CLI only. I've tried many ways to fix the issue, to reconfig xserver-xorg, consulted a friend of mine who's expert in Linux, couldn't solve it. (Solution, deleted Linux partition & reinstalled).
    Am using Kubuntu BTW, as for my desktop & sometimes you have to "sudo dolphin" to access certain areas where you need to modify a file or delete other file. And when you open any window in KDE, tells you an error about bookmarks or something.

    What I want to clear is, despite the stability of Linux "Which I myself testify for" it's still needs more work to make it easy for the end user.
    I like the idea of packages, where you do not have to compile the source code to be able to use the program. But still, not everything goes as smooth as it should be. I just wanted to play Yanni's Live Concert DVD the day before yesterday. And wasted too much time to be able to watch it yesterday. I've installed all restricted codecs & "libdvdcss" & many other packages such as "automatics" & some other players, but couldn't play it yet. The solution was with the simple shell command to install something in the "libdvdcss" after you have installed the package.
    The idea is, this is too much, how can you expect simple people to discover all those twists to be to able to do a simple task in Windows, where you just open the Windows Media Player & click play!

    As for me, am starting to spread the Linux word among my friends, as I've already switched to Linux as a default OS. But I cannot expect them to respond easily unless I prove that Linux is easy to use.
    Linux have gone far than ever in it being simpler for the user, but it still needs more effort.
    Am writing this because I know that the good people of Kubuntu here, whom are developing this wonderful OS, would keep pushing Linux further & further until it becomes easier, better & more reliable than ever. And as you know, that Intel is riding the Open Source wave http://oss.intel.com/en-us/
    So we should be more than happy, because if Intel headed that direction, am sure soon enough, many other hardware vendors will head that direction as well.
    Ah & BTW, Apple's latest OS is based on Unix, so that's considered to be testifying of the stability of the Unix OS.
    The last thing I want to say is, don't be mad at me for saying so, that Windows is easier to deal with that Linux, because that's the truth which I hope it won't last forever.
    So Linux ppl, may GOD bless you in what you are doing, just keep on moving & make our computer lives be better than ever.

    Best Wishes: 0x00FE

    #2
    Re: The Ease of Windows Vs the Hardness of Linux

    First, your comments about the 'ease of windows' vs that of Linux 'as viewed from the point of an average computer user' is probably true. But it might be better to comare Windoze / Linux to two cars - one with an automatic transmission (Windoze) and one with a manual transmission (Linux). Starting with that analogy (two cars), let's then divide the potential users into the following classes:

    1. Never driven before (afraid to get behind the wheel)
    2. New driver (manual transmissions scare them)
    3. New driver (learned on an automatic but wants to learn how to use a manual)
    4. Experienced driver (comfortable with a manual or automatic)
    5. Thrill driver (likes off-road adventures and racing)
    6. Hobbyist (likes to customize their ride)
    7. Manufacturer (builds their own rides)

    I think that what happens with 'newbies' who experience difficulties/problems with Linux in general and Kubuntu specifically, is that while very stylish in appearance, and when seen in operation, gives the impression of being a lot like 'that other OS.' That impression causes newbies to believe therefore, that installing it will be as easy as 'that other OS' was. Two problems with this belief.

    First, 'most' PCs that newbies have came pre-installed with 'that other OS' and so, never experienced first hand actually installing it themselves. So how can they compare the ease of installation?

    Second, manufactures of PCs (car body) ensure that any accessory being included will in fact, work with the powerplant (engine/OS). If they didn't, there would a lot of upset purchasers/users and sales would plummet and they would eventually go out of business.

    With a few exceptions, installing/using Linux could be compared to purchasing a car that was built by Chevrolet, then pulling the engine with the intent of installing a NASCAR Indy 500 racing engine - after all, it's just another engine, right? - and expecting it to 'just fit' and that when you turn the key, it will just start and all the accessories in the car will still work as they did before.

    Another analogy that might be clearer, is that of an organ transplant. The patient is in need of a new heart. A heart is a heart, right? Well, yes, but is the contemplated replacement 'compatible' with the patient?
    Windows no longer obstructs my view.
    Using Kubuntu Linux since March 23, 2007.
    "It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data." - Sherlock Holmes

    Comment


      #3
      Re: The Ease of Windows Vs the Hardness of Linux

      Originally posted by 0x00FE

      I get the idea that I'm going to be attacked if I wrote this subject without justifying why did I wrote it
      Even a guy named 0x00FE is not likely to be attacked on this forum -- we're mainly friendly.

      I pretty much agree with Snowhog on this -- his analogy is pretty good. My mother in-law is 77, never touched a computer before the year 2007, and uses Linux. The only "service call" I've had was when she somehow made her panel disappear -- she had a very hard time learning the mouse-clicking thing. So, she does her browsing, e-mailing, online banking and solitaire playing on a Comp USA cheapie PC running Kubuntu (Feisty upgraded to Gutsy). If you ask her, she will say that computers are not too hard to use.

      I kinda think most of the "it's so hard" moaning about Linux is actually the pain of un-learning what you thought you knew from MS DOS and Windows.

      Today's two cents' worth ....




      Edit: Yes, I also think well of Intel -- see my hardware listed below. 8)

      Comment


        #4
        Re: The Ease of Windows Vs the Hardness of Linux

        #1 Agree with above two posts.

        #2 The effort it takes to protect yourself from malware in Windows is horrendous and shameful. We all know damned smart people who have all the protection under the sun and still get wiped out now and then.

        #3 I started 95% XP and 5% Kubuntu, 2 years ago. I am now 99.9% Kubuntu and only log into XP to run all the crap protection programs, updates, scans, just because I don't want to be 100 MB behind on my virus definitions, scanner updates, etcetera ad nauseam, at least until the day I wipe it (I paid 100 bucks for the OEM XP disk through Newegg and was shocked the M$ website channeled me to the $35/hour category of support; before that, thousands $ on Windows professional products; sure don't plan to spend a nickel on Vista). Any convenience XP may offer is a high price to pay for the downside one must endure. In Linux, at least you * can * fix problems. My patience for M$ products and its mentality has run thin. Been using computers (all kinds) and programming since 1967.


        Thanks for the Intel link.
        And, of course, you are always welcome to express your thoughts here and generate discussion.

        An intellectual says a simple thing in a hard way. An artist says a hard thing in a simple way. Charles Bukowski

        Comment


          #5
          Re: The Ease of Windows Vs the Hardness of Linux

          Hey, I was anxiously waiting for what kind of reply I may get. Yeah, your friendly as I can see.

          I do agree with all of you in certain points,

          As for what "Snowhog" said, I like the analogy Impressive
          But the idea is, if you want people to use your car, then you have to give them options, to choose whether they want it full automatic or manual, which means here "GUI" & "CLI". Of course installing, replacing or fixing a new part may be as easy as replacing the wipers or hard as disassembling the gear box. So in windows, usually installing a new software or driver in Windows is much simpler than in Linux "Specially if it's not distributed in packages".
          But am not so afraid of that, I love complexity my self & am not talking here for myself, I want all people to start using Linux, but I just don't feel it's easy enough for all of people out there to handle themselves.

          As for "dibl" I'd love to see old ppl in touch with technology , but the idea is. Doing simple tasks such as browsing the Internet, reading your mail or writing documents is not something you can compare with. Cause it's so easy on Linux, there is nothing challenging there, she did not have to install a new software, hardware or a driver :P

          And as for "Qqmike",
          I started 95% XP and 5% Kubuntu, 2 years ago. I am now 99.9% Kubuntu and only ....
          I'm glad you said so, cause am following your steps, am starting to depend heavily on Linux, but I still have some problems when it comes to software support. Since am an Electrical Engineering Student, some certain softwares needed in university does not run but on Windows, so mostly I have to double boot to solve the issue. Games are also a problem, although some people suggested that games running under Linux, either using WineHQ or Cedega may even perform better than running under Windows, I didn't test that so I cannot judge.

          Anyways, I'm happy with your replies & thnx for making things even clear. I like the analogy & I hope you got my point as well.
          If I was only a computer programmer or had the sufficient time, I would really invest my time in the development of Linux, specially Kubuntu, I would really try to make it smoother for newbies. BTW, I consider myself one of them till the moment, although I can manage some of troubles that I run in while using Linux. Maybe in future, after finishing education, I might have the free time to learn some more programming languages beside C++ "which I've learned in uni".

          Best Wishes: 0x00FE

          Comment


            #6
            Re: The Ease of Windows Vs the Hardness of Linux

            All I can add is that everyone here has had something very worth while to say. I understand every view point and based on my experience all are valid. I've been MS fairly much since they first existed. It wasn't until an article in PC World that I took a look at Ubuntu. I actually used it to test and certify the network I manage at work (I figured if Linux could properly respond in that environment then it must be right ). That was a little over 3 years ago. Since that time I have found Kubuntu to be much nicer and all my personal machines run Kubuntu 98% of the time (yes I still dual boot due to work related troubleshooting) but the point is, I personally prefer Kubuntu over XP. I can't say much about Vista, but from my limited experience with it, Kubuntu is better hands down (personal opinion). I for one am surprised that I even switched due to how long I was with the other .

            Comment


              #7
              Re: The Ease of Windows Vs the Hardness of Linux

              Ok, let's see I was saying...
              Well, funny & strange things do happen with Linux : P
              Just after I wrote the previous reply, I was updating my desktop "Kubuntu 7.10" the one I had trouble installing the NVIDIA drivers, & something wrong went while updating. I restarted & now it refuses to boot. It says:
              ---------------
              Error 15: File not found

              Press any key to continue. . .
              ---------------
              Never had that problem with Windows, but I have to say, although some ppl report having BSOD after Windows update : P

              Guess you should wish me luck trying to fix this. (I guess am driving a total manual car now) "Not even Linux CLI, must work with Grub boot loader now " I guess" "

              Comment


                #8
                Re: The Ease of Windows Vs the Hardness of Linux

                Heh heh -- I'm tempted to tell the story about my Windows XP RAID array and how many hard drives you are "allowed" to have in your computer by Microsoft, but ... another day.

                The Grub error was caused by "something went wrong", probably. I'll speculate you changed a drive or BIOS setup related to hard drive boot sequence. Grub is now confused about which partition you have Kubuntu on. On the boot menu, highlight the line that is supposed to boot Kubuntu, and press "e" to edit it. Where it says "(hd0,1)" or whatever, you can change the number(s) and then do a "Enter" and press "b" to boot it. When you figure out what the correct drive and partition number are, you can use the Kate editor, in Super User mode, to edit that line in /boot/grub/menu.lst and make the change permanent by saving the edited file.

                Here's one of the many excellent tutorials on this Forum to help new users get around the mysteries of Linux:

                http://kubuntuforums.net/forums/inde...opic=3081671.0

                Comment


                  #9
                  Re: The Ease of Windows Vs the Hardness of Linux

                  Yeah.
                  Or see if you have an initrd file in /boot directory (or only a .bak file). This may be a bug.

                  What you might want to do is try a distro known to be fully ready-to-go (as the saying goes, "for Aunt Minnie"). I believe Xandros is the leader there--have seen lots of guys build PCs and load them with Xandros for non-Linux people who don't want XP;; maybe Linspire; I've seen people say this about Mint, too, that it's easy; Mepis was fairly easy when I tried it some time ago, but I'm not real certain about that just now since I've been away from it too long.

                  An intellectual says a simple thing in a hard way. An artist says a hard thing in a simple way. Charles Bukowski

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Re: The Ease of Windows Vs the Hardness of Linux

                    Ok, am so sorry I've switched this subject into fixing my computer rather general discussion.
                    Shall I open another subject?

                    And BTW, I just updated my Kubuntu 7.10 & when restarted cannot boot.
                    Thanks for the link "dibl", & thnx "Qqmike" for the notes,
                    Here is a snapshot of all data you might need to help with the issue.
                    http://www.hadeed-power.com/temp/lin.../snapshot1.png

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Re: The Ease of Windows Vs the Hardness of Linux

                      Yeah, on your /boot directory --
                      you only have a generic.bak for your initrd.img file; you need a regular initrd.img-2.6.22-14-generic file.
                      You can rename the .bak and remove the .bak extension; or do an initrafs update.
                      Hang on, there a recent post identical to this where we've written all this down somewhere. I'll try to search for it ...
                      An intellectual says a simple thing in a hard way. An artist says a hard thing in a simple way. Charles Bukowski

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Re: The Ease of Windows Vs the Hardness of Linux

                        http://kubuntuforums.net/forums/inde...opic=3091954.0
                        That's it.
                        An intellectual says a simple thing in a hard way. An artist says a hard thing in a simple way. Charles Bukowski

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Re: The Ease of Windows Vs the Hardness of Linux

                          If I may continue the automotive analogy -

                          I drove truck for years. I've witnessed many a stupid thing out on the road, and I man MANY.

                          IMHO, driver training is very insufficient. The written and the driving tests are far to simple. You would be AMAZED how many people are driving around our country's streets and roads who are simply incompetent.

                          How does that relate to computers?

                          Well, they guy who doesn't even know how to open a "dos box" or "command prompt" isn't competent to use a computer.

                          I know, that opinion won't be very popular, but neither is my opinion of motorists very popular.

                          To "drive" Linux, you must be competent. To "drive" Bill Gates OS, you only need to have faith in Bill.

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Re: The Ease of Windows Vs the Hardness of Linux

                            Originally posted by Runaway1956
                            To "drive" Linux, you must be competent. To "drive" Bill Gates OS, you only need to have faith in Bill.


                            Or, in otherwords, to use Windoze, you only need to know how to start the engine. To use Linux, it is very helpful if you know how to change the oil, fill the tank, check tire pressure, understand when a 'new noise' is something to worry about, ....
                            Windows no longer obstructs my view.
                            Using Kubuntu Linux since March 23, 2007.
                            "It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data." - Sherlock Holmes

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Re: The Ease of Windows Vs the Hardness of Linux

                              Yes on trucking, and there's a major projected shortage of truckers over the upcoming decade; the pay is good and getting better, too. Never done it, but know folks who have; it's getting popular among older couple-teams.

                              “To "drive" Bill Gates OS, you only need to have faith in Bill. “
                              Yes, and learn how to read the “Knowledge Base” articles, many of which have you running in circles.
                              An intellectual says a simple thing in a hard way. An artist says a hard thing in a simple way. Charles Bukowski

                              Comment

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