Common Sense

[GreyGeek]

https://oll.libertyfund.org/page/177...sense-pamphlet

Postscript to Preface in the third edition.

P. S. The Publication of this new Edition hath been delayed, with a view of taking notice (had it been necessary) of any attempt to refute the Doctrine of Independence: As no answer hath yet appeared, it is now presumed that none will, the time needful for getting such a Performance ready for the Public being considerably past.


Who the Author of this Production is, is wholly unnecessary to the Public, as the Object for Attention is the Doctrine itself, not the Man. Yet it may not be unnecessary to say, That he is unconnected with any party, and under no sort of Influence, public or private, but the influence of reason and principle.

America learned later that the author of the 47 page pamphlet, "Common Sense" was Thomas Paine. The reason he published it anonymously is obvious: if identified he faced prison or death.

https://notthebee.com/article/microsoft-forms-coalition-to-destroy-online-privacy-by-tracking-every-single-piece-of-digital-content-you-create
Microsoft, Intel, and Adobe are teaming up to destroy online privacy by tracking every single piece of digital content you create. The goal of their efforts: to stop "misinformation", i.e., "wrong think". Even if you never connected to the Internet, stored all your files on a flash drive and uploaded them using someone else's machine. If that ever comes to fruition then 1984 has truly arrived, if it hasn't already.

[TWPonKubuntu]

Thanks for this confirmation of my opinion of those companies...

[revmacian]

You know, I could track a person around town for a month and learn quite a bit of information. I could learn where they bank, where they live, where they work, where their friends live, where their family lives, their favorite eating establishments, where they buy the products they use, etc - reconnaissance isn't difficult. Why do so many people cry about privacy online but couldn't care less about privacy in real life public? So someone knows your real name on a forum.. so what? I can understand keeping secret information a secret.. which I would expect anyone to do whether in real life or online. So some company knows which websites I surf or products I buy? How does that keep me from obtaining food, shelter an clothing? It doesn't, it doesn't actually injure me at all.

So, why do people cry about something when no real injury has taken place? And, I'm using the word "injury" in the same sense that a court of law would use it.

I have tried to learn more about this but I've found that the people who cry about privacy are usually closed-minded and unwilling to listen when someone tries to explain that there is no real danger in some cases. They're so certain that someone is out to get them that they're on their guard all the time and unable to enjoy much of anything because they're always looking over their shoulder. It just seems to me that most of those people are their own worst enemy.. and they don't even realize it.

[GreyGeek]

You know, I could track a person around town for a month and learn quite a bit of information. I could learn where they bank, where they live, where they work, where their friends live, where their family lives, their favorite eating establishments, where they buy the products they use, etc - reconnaissance isn't difficult. Why do so many people cry about privacy online but couldn't care less about privacy in real life public? So someone knows your real name on a forum.. so what?

What you would be doing is called stalking. If YOU did that and I noticed, I'd obtain a restraining order on you to cease and desist because I wouldn't know your intent. TO answer your specific question: YOU are not the government. Unless you are a psychopath or a thug you can't put a gun to my head to force me to obey your commands. The gov can. When the Constitution still meant something the gov was forbidden by the Constitution to choose winners and loosers in in social conflicts, but that is no longer the case.

I can understand keeping secret information a secret.. which I would expect anyone to do whether in real life or online. So some company knows which websites I surf or products I buy? How does that keep me from obtaining food, shelter an clothing? It doesn't, it doesn't actually injure me at all.

So, why do people cry about something when no real injury has taken place? And, I'm using the word "injury" in the same sense that a court of law would use it.

Have you been off the planet for the last decade? You do know that Google wrote China's Social Credit System, which controls the ability any particular Chinese person to travel by public means, maintain a bank account, hold a job, or even do business at the local food, clothing and grocery stores. Google wants to employ it here too. However, its effects are happening here in America as well.

I have tried to learn more about this but I've found that the people who cry about privacy are usually closed-minded and unwilling to listen when someone tries to explain that there is no real danger in some cases. They're so certain that someone is out to get them that they're on their guard all the time and unable to enjoy much of anything because they're always looking over their shoulder. It just seems to me that most of those people are their own worst enemy.. and they don't even realize it.

Ya, Thomas Paine was really closed-minded. IF he had been caught by the British he might not have had a mind at all. That's why the pamphlet "Common Sense" didn't have his name on it till after the Revolutionary war was won. Talk about closed-minded, have you tried to hold a conversation with Benjamin Franklin? George Washington? Thomas Jefferson? They had the ludicrous idea that some rights were God given and inalienable (that means they cannot be removed from you by mere governments). Can you imagine someone being allowed to say anything they want (except "fire" in a crowded theater)? Or even worse, being allowed to possess and own firearms for their own protection and to protect themselves from a government gone rogue? Outrageous!

I'll assume from your comments that you've never said anything the Marxist disagree with? BTW, what does "closed-minded" mean? They don't agree with you? Are you willing to listen to them? Are you your own worst enemy? See how easy it is to play that game. Those accusations add heat but rarely light.

The cancel culture is getting so bad that the "WOKE" are going back years to find reasons to "cancel" (get the victims fired from their jobs, their homes foreclosed, their bank accounts canceled, etc) people they disagree with, even when those people express the simple truth. Have you heard of the Chinese Red Guards? They did the same thing. Don't worry about it. The way things are going sooner or later your ox will get gored as well. The Marxist got Gina Carano fired from Disney because they disagreed with her opinions on Twitter and Facebook. They canceled Trump, too. Think they'll cancel Joe? Not satisfied with getting Carano fired they went back looking for people she associated with in the past. They discovered that she once data Henry Cavill, the man who played Superman, 10 years ago. Now they are trying to "cancel" him. See how its working? It's the old #MeToo on steroids. You are not as safe as you think you are. I am a Conservative. You and I are having a civil exchange of opinions. IF I become the target of a cancel campaign you are not safe either, because you are being civil with me.

[revmacian]

What you would be doing is called stalking. If YOU did that and I noticed, I'd obtain a restraining order on you to cease and desist because I wouldn't know your intent. TO answer your specific question: YOU are not the government. Unless you are a psychopath or a thug you can't put a gun to my head to force me to obey your commands. The gov can. When the Constitution still meant something the gov was forbidden by the Constitution to choose winners and loosers in in social conflicts, but that is no longer the case.

Have you been off the planet for the last decade? You do know that Google wrote China's Social Credit System, which controls the ability any particular Chinese person to travel by public means, maintain a bank account, hold a job, or even do business at the local food, clothing and grocery stores. Google wants to employ it here too. However, its effects are happening here in America as well.

Ya, Thomas Paine was really closed-minded. IF he had been caught by the British he might not have had a mind at all. That's why the pamphlet "Common Sense" didn't have his name on it till after the Revolutionary war was won. Talk about closed-minded, have you tried to hold a conversation with Benjamin Franklin? George Washington? Thomas Jefferson? They had the ludicrous idea that some rights were God given and inalienable (that means they cannot be removed from you by mere governments). Can you imagine someone being allowed to say anything they want (except "fire" in a crowded theater)? Or even worse, being allowed to possess and own firearms for their own protection and to protect themselves from a government gone rogue? Outrageous!

I'll assume from your comments that you've never said anything the Marxist disagree with? BTW, what does "closed-minded" mean? They don't agree with you? Are you willing to listen to them? Are you your own worst enemy? See how easy it is to play that game. Those accusations add heat but rarely light.

The cancel culture is getting so bad that the "WOKE" are going back years to find reasons to "cancel" (get the victims fired from their jobs, their homes foreclosed, their bank accounts canceled, etc) people they disagree with, even when those people express the simple truth. Have you heard of the Chinese Red Guards? They did the same thing. Don't worry about it. The way things are going sooner or later your ox will get gored as well. The Marxist got Gina Carano fired from Disney because they disagreed with her opinions on Twitter and Facebook. They canceled Trump, too. Think they'll cancel Joe? Not satisfied with getting Carano fired they went back looking for people she associated with in the past. They discovered that she once data Henry Cavill, the man who played Superman, 10 years ago. Now they are trying to "cancel" him.

See how its working? It's the old #MeToo on steroids. You are not as safe as you think you are. I am a Conservative. You and I are having a civil exchange of opinions. IF I become the target of a cancel campaign you are not safe either, because you are being civil with me.

How does any of that prevent me from obtaining food, shelter or clothing today? I ask this question every time conspiracy theorists rattle their sabres, but none of them have ever been able to answer the question. They can't answer that question.. because the answer would nullify their agenda.

Update: You seem to be focused on a great many things. I feel you would benefit from taking a step back and asking yourself how much of what you say is actually preventing you from living your life right now. I'm not talking about what happened hundreds of years ago, the past cannot be changed and holding a grudge doesn't actually benefit you. I'm not talking about what might happen in the future, it's not set in stone. Many times someone will say things to try to win you over to their cause. What you need to ask yourself is "will their cause be a waste of my resources? Is it worth allowing their problem to become my problem?". Never live someone else's life, you have to go and make your own adventure.

[Bings]

How does any of that prevent me from obtaining food, shelter or clothing today?

If I was your employer and I saw your post here, recognised your face from the avatar, read your myopic world view opinion and then sacked you because I didn't like it, wouldn't you feel aggrieved?

[Goeroeboeroe]

You know, I could track a person around town for a month and learn quite a bit of information. I could learn where they bank, where they live, where they work, where their friends live, where their family lives, their favorite eating establishments, where they buy the products they use, etc - reconnaissance isn't difficult. Why do so many people cry about privacy online but couldn't care less about privacy in real life public? So someone knows your real name on a forum.. so what? I can understand keeping secret information a secret.. which I would expect anyone to do whether in real life or online. So some company knows which websites I surf or products I buy? How does that keep me from obtaining food, shelter an clothing? It doesn't, it doesn't actually injure me at all.

So, why do people cry about something when no real injury has taken place? And, I'm using the word "injury" in the same sense that a court of law would use it.

I have tried to learn more about this but I've found that the people who cry about privacy are usually closed-minded and unwilling to listen when someone tries to explain that there is no real danger in some cases. They're so certain that someone is out to get them that they're on their guard all the time and unable to enjoy much of anything because they're always looking over their shoulder. It just seems to me that most of those people are their own worst enemy.. and they don't even realize it.

If you don't know the difference between stalking ONE person and between stalking EVERYBODY, I think you may have a little small problem understanding things.
Stalking one person takes a lot of trouble (at least five people are needed to follow somebody full time). This initiative can follow everybody online with hardly any people needed.
You may have no problem at all with this, but maybe you should think a little bit about people living in a country a less bit free. Doesn't matter if it's left or right wing authoritarian. Or, like somebody already wrote, if your boss doesn't like what you write. Or your landlord. Or ...
One of the nice things from internet used to be that GreyGeek could write what he wanted, and me too. We disagree about a lot of things, but as long a he doesn't call on people to kill me or something like that, he should be free to write what he wants. Without being followed by a government or some companies. The same goes for me, of course.
People that have really, really, really, completely nothing to hide, must have a very dull life.

[revmacian]

If I was your employer and I saw your post here, recognised your face from the avatar, read your myopic world view opinion and then sacked you because I didn't like it, wouldn't you feel aggrieved?

That's called seeking revenge because you don't agree with my opinion, and it is one of the bases for almost every oppressive government. No, I wouldn't feel bad for me, in fact I would feel sorry for you because you're allowing your fears or anger to spitefully damage others. That's not the proper way to treat people. I actually feel bad for people who walk around with such a fragile ego.

[revmacian]

If you don't know the difference between stalking ONE person and between stalking EVERYBODY, I think you may have a little small problem understanding things.
Stalking one person takes a lot of trouble (at least five people are needed to follow somebody full time). This initiative can follow everybody online with hardly any people needed.
You may have no problem at all with this, but maybe you should think a little bit about people living in a country a less bit free. Doesn't matter if it's left or right wing authoritarian. Or, like somebody already wrote, if your boss doesn't like what you write. Or your landlord. Or ...
One of the nice things from internet used to be that GreyGeek could write what he wanted, and me too. We disagree about a lot of things, but as long a he doesn't call on people to kill me or something like that, he should be free to write what he wants. Without being followed by a government or some companies. The same goes for me, of course.
People that have really, really, really, completely nothing to hide, must have a very dull life.

This is typical behavior, focus on the bad and ignore the point. How does someone stalking me actually prevent me from obtaining food, shelter or clothing? Please don't dance around the question like most people do, answer the question. People dance around a question because they don't know how to actually answer it.

How does someone stalking me actually prevent me from obtaining food, shelter or clothing? I'm not trying to be stupid or careless.. I'm trying to get you folks to see something. Put your fears away and focus on pure fact.

My boss could very easily see what I post on various forums, but I refuse to allow fear to prevent me from speaking. Fear cannot be used to control someone who doesn't care about losing everything. If someone were to evict me or fire me because of my opinion, then I would simply go elsewhere and obtain food shelter or clothing - my landlord/boss/banker/mechanic/doctor are not "the only game in town". I would think it would be a really sad life to go around allowing one's fears to control them.

Fear is not my master!

[GreyGeek]

"Fear is not my master!"

Bravely written, and in large font and bold RED no less! You must really mean it,

We'll see how that courage plays out when you are being accused of something politically incorrect and "canceled" merely because of the color of your skin, or because of the religious or political views you hold. It doesn't matter if you've been a member of good standing in the counter culture for years, one past or current misquote out of step with the current opinion makers and you will be history. Ask Roseann Barr how that works, or any of the other Hollywood stars who thought they were fighting the "good fight" against Fascism. What they didn't realize is that anyone to the right of Karl Marx is considered a Fascist these days. It's just a continuation of past practices, as Trotsky found out.

[claydoh]

Oh, jeez, another one of these sh**ty threads

[TWPonKubuntu]

Thanks GG, you are being more polite than I would be with respect to those who fail to see the anti-privacy bus which is running over us right now. They know who they are and I'm ready to tell them: "I told you so", after that bus hits them. If they even survive...

Tolerance? Intolerance? No. I call it respect for human rights, as recognized by the Founding Fathers in the US Constitution and The Bill Of Rights.

Watch for the bus...

[TWPonKubuntu]

@claydoh, I hope that was satire on your part...

Everybody: pour yourself a cuppa and enjoy the Community Cafe ambiance... At least until TPTB try to shut down the cafe...

[Bings]

That's called seeking revenge because you don't agree with my opinion, and it is one of the bases for almost every oppressive government. No, I wouldn't feel bad for me, in fact I would feel sorry for you because you're allowing your fears or anger to spitefully damage others. That's not the proper way to treat people. I actually feel bad for people who walk around with such a fragile ego.

Well, this is the reality for people who are having their employment terminated because of "cancel culture" and if you can't get employment because of these things then that affects your basic needs.

[claydoh]

@claydoh, I hope that was satire on your part...

Everybody: pour yourself a cuppa and enjoy the Community Cafe ambiance... At least until TPTB try to shut down the cafe...

No satire at all. Tired old conversations devolving in to uselessness within a page or three. As expected, I imagine, maybe even by design.

I have long supported getting rid of the Cafe, though I seldom ever bring the idea up.
The same people (usually) start Off Topic posts (to the overall purpose of KFN) , on things that are guaranteed to bring in negative discourse.
I *hate* being forced into a position of having to close a thread with people getting heated., no matter who actually started it.