Just Fired Microsoft

[oshunluvr]

I occasionally dig into what alternatives are available, but there aren't many. I still look at what goggle provides me in the way of integration of services and it is unmatched. I can get private, secure, encrypted email for like $12 a year. But then I have to give up the calendar, payment options, etc. Give up Chromium? No password manager. How about using a VPN all the time? I travel a lot and work on hundreds of computers in hundreds of locations and the amount of work that it would take to disconnect from google just isn't worth the protection from the magical unknown multi-headed monster that some people see out there. Don't forget that VPNs are notoriously slow.

I'm very close to Don on this, I really don't have anything worth stealing - data-wise. Want pictures of my dog or a copy of my text conversation with my mom about her house? Go ahead. Why is the internet different than real life? If I walk outside, I have no expectation of privacy in this country. I behave the same in the digital world. Nothing I send out on the net or via my phone is really private and it's an illusion to believe otherwise and I'm not sure I'm owed that expectation. The hard part is convincing a teenage girl of that. Yes, you can make it harder to get, but that costs you - in difficulty and workload if not cash. By the way, I haven't painted over my windows nor do I wear a tin hat. Since I have a security clearance (albeit a low one) and have worked in a public safety related job my entire adult life I have almost no right to total privacy. Want to know what that's been done to me because of that? Not a single thing. I do shred my important mail and documents (if it has an account number, shred it) because that's actually the #1 way identity theft occurs.

Frankly, IMO as a society and country we have much larger issues that are real day-to-day ones and targeted advertising just isn't one of them. I fail to understand the complaints about online censorship on privately owned platforms in mediums that didn't exist a decade ago while others allow the spread of absolute untruths and are allowed to masquerade as "news" or other sources. IMO censorship and lack of total privacy aren't anywhere near as dangerous as the lack of transparency and accountability. It's ironic that internet privacy is the very thing that let's hostile foreign governments, super-pacs, pedophiles, and terrorist organizations operate with impunity while common people who have little or nothing to fear from exposure wail on about the lack of it.

Let's not forget that most other countries have much less privacy rules than the USA. You could always move to Norway or Switzerland I suppose. Seems a bit much to safeguard info no one really wants anyway. I'm not saying it couldn't or shouldn't be better, but often it's way more just FUD than reality.

Anyway, just my opinions.

[Snowhog]

Absolute privacy is a myth. It probably always has been, even before technology.

Privacy and Security are not the same thing. Securing my online accounts: Important. Securing my Personal Privacy: Less so. The latter because I understand that being 'online' exposes me based on what data I opt to allow. We live in the digital age, and that means that we are tracked, whether we like it or not.

[TWPonKubuntu]

Well, you may have already surmised that I do not choose to 'go quietly into the night' with respect to my online privacy and security.

That is one of the reasons why I left Windows some years ago. It is why I do not support the use of Google or social media, among other tools in the digital world.

Again, it is your choice. But I will not be silent and watch others make choices which harm themselves or others who may be influenced by what they claim to 'not matter'. It matters.

Please don't 'drink the Koolaid'...

[oshunluvr]

Absolute privacy is a myth. It probably always has been, even before technology.

Privacy and Security are not the same thing. Securing my online accounts: Important. Securing my Personal Privacy: Less so. The latter because I understand that being 'online' exposes me based on what data I opt to allow. We live in the digital age, and that means that we are tracked, whether we like it or not.

Well stated.

[oshunluvr]

Funny, Snowhog's comment reminded me of something in my childhood - the part about privacy always being a myth. Once in a conversation where I was asking my mother about money, I asked how much we paid for our house. She told me, but not before saying in a very serious tone and glare "not to tell anyone..." I didn't understand why back then - I was around 9 or 10 - and I still don't. Now I can log onto my county website and see who owns what properties, exactly what they paid, what their taxes are, and what size their foundation is (a tax calculation factor here). Probably back then, I could have gone to the courthouse and requested public records as property sales are public record, so it was never actually private. While the internet has eased access to that info, it's not the reason I can get it. Now, and just like then, I could bother to form a corporation, possibly with a foreign corporate owner, and totally obscure who owned what. That goes back to effort and cost vs. actual privacy.

The interesting adjunct to ownership records is how you can see the marriage/divorce cycles of many of your neighbors as the deeds changed hands. Again, information that was always probably always available but harder to get.

Here's a fun test: Google yourself. I come up eventually if you focus on tech stuff like stack exchange and maybe twitter if you know my middle initial. Fortunately (maybe), there's a rather famous musician that shares a first and last name with me so you mostly get him, although I hate that people might think I have that hair . I can't ever find my wife or her sisters or almost anyone else I know.

I did once have a fun experience; There's a man in London who shares my name exactly. I know he lives in London because his email address is/was so close to mine (both gmail) that apparently he used mine on several locations. I know he took his family on vacation to Spain and when because I got his flight confirmations. I received something several times a year for a few years until it culminated finally in our Uber accounts somehow becoming crossed. I was in Los Angeles and requested an Uber to the airport. The Uber guy arrived and away I went. I looked down and saw my charge was in Pounds not Dollars. Before I could process that, the ride was cancelled. Obviously my email twin had been notified of the ride and hit the cancel button. Luckily, the Uber driver took the fare in cash and took me on to the airport. Looking at the Uber account, I was able to locate his home and work locations exactly because his ride history was on my phone. A little scary, right? Fortunately, the credit card info was shrouded and I couldn't see it without his password. I mean fortunate that the security is at least that good - I wasn't planning on stealing anything!

I still have no idea how this happened. I contacted Uber and they were unable to straighten it out and claimed it was Google's fault. I contacted Google - and yes they exchanged several emails with me over a couple weeks - and they claimed it was impossible for us to have the same email address and that he (the London one of me) must have used the wrong email address to sign up with Uber. It was never straightened out but by then Lyft had entered the scene and I've used them ever since. Uber said after six months the account info would be purged and I could sign up again so I deleted the app. They must have contacted London-me and made him aware of what had happened because I never received another email of his. I wanted to show up on his doorstep and point out to him in person that checking what email address he was using was important, but I never got back to London since this all happened.

[TexasGuy1988]

@TexasGuy1988. yes, my last post was directed at you.

Since you opened a new Google account, they are now tracking you, again...

I never used Google for email nor did I ever create an account with them. They still know me by my IP address and I'm certain there are one or more entries in their database...

Never try to play with that snake. It is poisonous.

Yes...unfortunately I discovered that after I had spent 4 FULL DAYS deleting myself, all content, and activity from Google. It is by pure happenstance that I checked to see if I left anything. Under the new bogus account they had been tracking everything. How many times I texted and to who, how many times I used my banking app, and for how long. I was very dismayed. No matter. I have found a site that walks me through how to root a phone and install a mobile Linux OS. I can even use the mobile version of Kubuntu if I choose. I have already purchased the suggested phone and it just has to get delivered. I have some questions regarding the process, but that is for another thread.

[TexasGuy1988]

Hammering away at this criticism of Google, starts to sound like a virtual echo chamber, IMO very like many conspiracy theories, or corporate propaganda.

Why are they so bad? Sure, Google is an advertising company, and they provide all those convenient services the better to sell advertising about you to their customers, who have learned that using Google is far more effective than older advertising methods.

But, it is not in Google's interest to sell you out, or to facilitate selling you out. I'm aware that this is a pathetically weak defence of Google. There are a few others, like Google playing nice with open source projects (we wouldn't have an Ubuntu-based distro without Google's support of Canonical), but still weak.

Other big corporates have far worse records for poison, especially Microsoft, Apple, and Facebook. Why the hate for Google, compared to them?

In fact, much of the criticism of Google originated in FUD from other companies, particularly Microsoft. Also, being outside the politics of the USA, I hear a strong resonance from (what I call) right-wing criticism of "liberal" companies and Google's critics. Anything associated with that morass of deceit, denial of science, and brain-washing makes me inclined toward any opposing view.

Now, my opinion is that much of what Google does needs to be far more open and subject to public oversight. However, Google resists this strongly because they have to work so hard to stay ahead of those who want to manipulate the advertising results. (IMO far-reaching laws that make deceit and manipulative actions illegal are needed, but that's another colossal issue.)

But, the clincher is, Google's tendencies to drop whole platforms, or change the way they work, or go off in completely different directions, while paying almost no attention to what their users say, or argue, means it's a huge risk to depend on them. I'll come to like and rely on some service, finding it far better than alternatives, then they'll make a change and I'm screwed. For example, I only still find Gmail tolerable because I can use alternative e-mail clients and IMAP to access it.

So, how to de-Google, and avoid becoming locked in to some other service provider? (I'm exploring having my own services in a hosting service somewhere, so that I can move it easily. As a Kubuntu user, I've found I've got a huge headstart in spinning up an Ubuntu instance.)

• In this thread a poster said the first step is to use search engines like Duck Duck go.
• How do I move off Gmail? Is it necessary to have my own domain, so that I control my e-mail address? And contacts generally, I don't now any open server software that I could use.
• Google maps is good because it's running on so many phones, so it knows where congestion is, and how long various routes take. An alternative, say from Duck Duck Go, just won't have the data that Google has. I think this is a case of the public good needing an open, regulated, repository of movement data, maybe much as phone books became subject to regulation. But, is there something I can do now?
• YouTube? Many people have become dependent on that platform, and have been mucked around by changes there. I try to support worthy content creators, but it quickly adds up.
  
  But what can we do?

Well for starters, I am a simple person. I am satisfied with simple things. I haven't bought new clothes for half a decade, and only do when I must. My truck is 12 years old and has over 100k miles, and I have no plans to replace it. My TV is 14 years old, and I am perfectly satisfied with it. The computer I am currently using is a refurbished 5 year old model when I bought it...6 years ago. Point being, I never saw an ad that made me want to buy a product. If I want something, I research it and then go get it. I am impervious to advertising and I find them very annoying.

Now consider the sheer amount of data they track. Your every location and trip you make. Every single time you map a route. Every picture, video, text, and phone call you make. It is all tracked and stored. I deleted nearly a decade worth of YouTube activity. The stuff I was into 10 years ago points to a different person than I was. Someone I didn't necessarily like. I don't need that information laying around and being sold to the highest bidder. I don't know a single person that wants their entire history to be open and viewed and I also don't know a single person that hasn't changed a bit for better or worse in a decade.

That information pulls me back into a place where I don't need to be. I understand that there is little I can do about the information they already have. But over my dead body will they get anymore.

Lastly, I have had to cancel and replace at least 1 debit or credit card very single year for as long as I can remember. Twice I have had to go through official credit fraud processes. Enough is enough. I will do what I am able to do to secure my information.

[Don B. Cilly]

... I have found a site that walks me through how to root a phone and install a mobile Linux OS.

Installing Ubuntu Touch - on a compatible device - is really quite simple. The UBports installer will root the phone for you.

I can even use the mobile version of Kubuntu if I choose.

If by that you mean Plasma mobile...
- It's not that easy.
- It's not a "phone". You can't talk over it. You can connect a Bluetooth keyboard and mouse and hack away, though :·)

[TexasGuy1988]

Installing Ubuntu Touch - on a compatible device - is really quite simple. The UBports installer will root the phone for you.

If by that you mean Plasma mobile...
- It's not that easy.
- It's not a "phone". You can't talk over it. You can connect a Bluetooth keyboard and mouse and hack away, though :·)

Yes Ubuntu touch is what I am talking about. The site suggest the Nexus 5. It is the most compatible. The Ubports installer is exactly what I am talking about. I have a few questions in regard to the process and I will start a dedicated thread for it.

[Don B. Cilly]

I have a Nexus 5 with it and it works just fine.
The interface is Unity-based, which I find slightly annoying, but one gets used to it.

For maps I use uNav which has offline maps.

[MoonRise]

Absolute privacy is a myth. It probably always has been, even before technology.

Privacy and Security are not the same thing. Securing my online accounts: Important. Securing my Personal Privacy: Less so. The latter because I understand that being 'online' exposes me based on what data I opt to allow. We live in the digital age, and that means that we are tracked, whether we like it or not.

I have found this thread interesting but I would have to +1 Snowhog on this.

[TexasGuy1988]

I have a Nexus 5 with it and it works just fine.
The interface is Unity-based, which I find slightly annoying, but one gets used to it.

For maps I use uNav which has offline maps.

Okay if I PM you when I get my phone (the Nexus 5) ? I made a dry run, to see how it would work, and it didn't do right.

[Don B. Cilly]

Sure, or we can have a public thread about it. It's not Kubuntu, but maybe some people would be interested anyway.

[jglen490]

"Paranoia strikes deep. Into your life it will creep. It starts when you're always afraid, step outta line the Man comes to take you away."

Living a simple life has nothing to do with isolation, or with deliberately denying yourself. I'm not a rich guy, and I tend to keep my vehicles for a while. But there is a tipping point where thrift costs.

I have also learned to avoid some of those activities that will only increase my exposure and risk. I'm on this site, for instance but I avoid Facebook, et al, because all they do is commoditize the user, and not for the benefit of the user but for the benefit of that snarky young billionaire. In fairness, he's not the only one, but I'd rather avoid being a source of great income while using a "free" product. Sure, Google is no angel either, but make your choices, manage your risk.

[TWPonKubuntu]

@jglen490 - glad to see you know the song.