spying on us -- what's real, what's hyperbole?

[Tom_ZeCat]

We all know about the NSA, I'm sure. However, my excessively paranoid roommate claims that everyone, including crooks, can spy on you via your cell phone. He claims it's important to plug a slug into your PC's mike port; otherwise the NSA, a mafia member, or some other criminal can listen in on your conversations. He says it's true even if you use Linux PCs, and no Windows or Mac.

He also claims that the NSA, the mafia, and the other usual criminals can tap into your cell phone, listening to all your calls and reading all your texts and that anyone can track down your location. He says all of them can also tap into your web cam at any time unless you unplug it (USB version) or cover it with tape (built-in version).

How much of this is true and how much is false?

[jeffhutch.412]

I think your roommates been reading on too many exaggerated internet news sites. If the nsa had collected any of your info, theres like a 0% chance that it's been seen it heard by human ears. Unless there's something for them too listen too... It's your roommate trying to hide something??!! Haha jk

[jglen490]

The technology is not magic, so, yes, it is POSSIBLE to evesdrop, spy, etc. on anyone's connection. Does it happen? Yes, in some cases it is the NSA collecting whatever they collect and in other cases it's called identity theft. Can it be mitigated? Yes, follow safe computing practices and it's not so likely to happen. It's not magic, but just like anything else watch what street you travel.

[oshunluvr]

We all know about the NSA, I'm sure. However, my excessively paranoid roommate claims that everyone, including crooks, can spy on you via your cell phone. He claims it's important to plug a slug into your PC's mike port; otherwise the NSA, a mafia member, or some other criminal can listen in on your conversations. He says it's true even if you use Linux PCs, and no Windows or Mac.

He also claims that the NSA, the mafia, and the other usual criminals can tap into your cell phone, listening to all your calls and reading all your texts and that anyone can track down your location. He says all of them can also tap into your web cam at any time unless you unplug it (USB version) or cover it with tape (built-in version).

How much of this is true and how much is false?

IMO, your roommate may need professional help - and I don't mean from an anti-spy professional. At a minimum, he (she?) needs a serious reality check.

Explain how a mic port (not a microphone) can transmit sound.

BTW, the Mafia is all but gone - at least here - and if they are here - do you really think a criminal organization mostly reliant on drug trafficking, prostitution, protection, loan sharking, etc., has any interest in you or your roommate?

Camera tapping? Sure, it can and has been done, but usually by installing software that allows it. But how does the NSA get your root password? Has the NSA inserted a back door into the Linux kernel? Ask Linus.

And again - what makes you think they're watching you? Tell your roommate movies are not real and the news media hypes stories to get attention and they don't often care if they're telling the truth.

IMO, in the real world of computer security there's Possible/Impossible, Probable/Improbable, and Likely/Unlikely. Much of what your roommate says is Impossible and ALL of it is Improbable and Unlikely.

Viruses? With linux: Improbable, with Windows: Likely. Scams via email? Likely to the point of being a certainty. So don't install anything from an unknown source and trust me, no Nigerian Prince has a billion dollars to get out of Africa and needs your help to do it.

[oshunluvr]

It's not magic, but just like anything else watch what street you travel.

...Good piece of advice that.

[millusions]

its quite obvious, your room mate does way too much pot

[GreyGeek]

A laptop has an internal speaker and an internal mic. When you plug a headset in the external mic and headphones become the active mic and speaker and the internal mic and speakers are mechanically disconnected.

Is it possible that an application can activate the mic without your knowledge and "listen in" to conversations the mic in the headset (or internal mic) can pick up? Of course. And turn on the webcam? Of course.

If you've run certain java apps you may have seen a dialog popping up asking your permission to allow access to your mic, speakers, screen or webcam. Good apps ask. Bad ones do not. I always keep a notepad sheet covering my webcam. I also keep the mic switch on my headset turned off, unless I am using a VOIP. Some folks don't install java, but java isn't the only way nefarious software can get into your computer, especially if it does memory calls like shellcode does. On Linux boxes the odds aren't as great as on Windows boxes, but the odds are not zero.

Your cellphone has a setting for either "Location" or "E911 Only". If you've set the former then anyone with access to cell towers and/or service provider type equipment can follow you anywhere you go. Supposedly, if only "E911" is set, your location is revealed only when you call 911. The same people who can track your geo-location have access to service provider equipment which allows them to turn on your cellphone/smartphone mic and listen in to any conversation within the sensitivity of the mic while the cellphone is in standby mode, or even OFF, without the phone owners knowing or realizing it. It's been used by law enforcement to listen in suspects conversations EVEN when the cellphone was in standby, not being used, or turned off.

Government agents also work by getting between you and the nearest cell tower, man-in-the-middle, with a box that behaves like a cell tower but allows the agents to record the audio.

The only way to keep a cellphone or smartphone from being used as a spy-device by those with the proper equipment, or access to service providers equipment, is to take the batteries out of the phone, then start the super secret conversation. Put the batteries back in when the conversation is done. Turning off the cell phone doesn't guarantee a thing.
http://www.wired.com/2014/03/webcams-mics/
http://news.cnet.com/FBI-taps-cell-p...3-6140191.html

[jeffhutch.412]

It is possible, but the odds of it happening are like =-O (prob not gonna happen) AND I'm pretty sure it would have to be through a- a program w/ root privileges, or b- possibly done remotely? Like team viewer-ish, or I've seen an article about people being able to gain access via your unsecured wifi/ get you mac address (or some other id) etc, but to gain root at that point, they'd need your password... And I think if devices were being modified, a security notification would popup? But really, I don't know haha and technically almost anything is possible I guess... But I think it would require some hefty hacking, and more motive than curiosity.. O:-)

[Tom_ZeCat]

its quite obvious, your room mate does way too much pot

He does not smoke pot or do any illegal drugs or drink alcohol and neither do I.

[Tom_ZeCat]

A laptop has an internal speaker and an internal mic. When you plug a headset in the external mic and headphones become the active mic and speaker and the internal mic and speakers are mechanically disconnected.

Is it possible that an application can activate the mic without your knowledge and "listen in" to conversations the mic in the headset (or internal mic) can pick up? Of course. And turn on the webcam? Of course.

If you've run certain java apps you may have seen a dialog popping up asking your permission to allow access to your mic, speakers, screen or webcam. Good apps ask. Bad ones do not. I always keep a notepad sheet covering my webcam. I also keep the mic switch on my headset turned off, unless I am using a VOIP. Some folks don't install java, but java isn't the only way nefarious software can get into your computer, especially if it does memory calls like shellcode does. On Linux boxes the odds aren't as great as on Windows boxes, but the odds are not zero.

Your cellphone has a setting for either "Location" or "E911 Only". If you've set the former then anyone with access to cell towers and/or service provider type equipment can follow you anywhere you go. Supposedly, if only "E911" is set, your location is revealed only when you call 911. The same people who can track your geo-location have access to service provider equipment which allows them to turn on your cellphone/smartphone mic and listen in to any conversation within the sensitivity of the mic while the cellphone is in standby mode, or even OFF, without the phone owners knowing or realizing it. It's been used by law enforcement to listen in suspects conversations EVEN when the cellphone was in standby, not being used, or turned off.

Government agents also work by getting between you and the nearest cell tower, man-in-the-middle, with a box that behaves like a cell tower but allows the agents to record the audio.

The only way to keep a cellphone or smartphone from being used as a spy-device by those with the proper equipment, or access to service providers equipment, is to take the batteries out of the phone, then start the super secret conversation. Put the batteries back in when the conversation is done. Turning off the cell phone doesn't guarantee a thing.
http://www.wired.com/2014/03/webcams-mics/
http://news.cnet.com/FBI-taps-cell-p...3-6140191.html

I barely use my cell phone and am not doing anything illegal, so I'm not too worried. However, I make it a policy never to talk to my bank with my cell phone. We still have a landline for that purpose. I keep electrical tape over my built-in webcam, which is junky and I never use. I have a quality one that I plug in and unplug when not in use. I did see an article about a perv who worked at a school who tapped into the webcam of a computer that a kid had taken home. This school had loan-out laptops. That was creepy.

I would think someone who was actually a criminal would never talk openly on their regular cell phone. If I were some kind of drug dealer, I would have a regular cell phone that I use to keep in touch with family on without any qualms. Then I would have my dealing phone under the same John Smith or Mark Jones or whatever, which would use one of the encryption apps to scramble all calls. Before talking on it, I would take the battery out of my regular phone. If I can think of this, I imagine a regular criminal can, right?

I have been leery of Java-based apps. I have two on this Kubuntu PC. One's just a subtitle editor and the other is a blackjack program. I'll probably uninstall the blackjack one. It's crap. The subtitle editor is quite good, however, in some ways nicer than the C++ based one that I also have.

[SteveRiley]

everyone, including crooks, can spy on you via your cell phone

True. One can construct a device that spoofs a cell tower.
http://www.wired.com/2010/07/interce...l-phone-calls/

He claims it's important to plug a slug into your PC's mike port; otherwise the NSA, a mafia member, or some other criminal can listen in on your conversations.

False. The microphone port is useless without something attached. See, however, my forthcoming reply to Jerry's later statement.

He says it's true even if you use Linux PCs, and no Windows or Mac.

True, in the general sense that hardware tampering (and subsequent software misdirection) is possible regardless of what boots the computer.

He also claims that the NSA, the mafia, and the other usual criminals can tap into your cell phone, listening to all your calls and reading all your texts and that anyone can track down your location.

True. See previous link to article about Blackhat presention.

He says all of them can also tap into your web cam at any time unless you unplug it (USB version) or cover it with tape (built-in version).

True if you allow someone else to install, either locally or remotely, software onto your PC that can activate the webcam.
False if you maintain tight control over what runs on your computer.
http://www.wired.com/2010/04/webcamscanda/

[SteveRiley]

A laptop has an internal speaker and an internal mic. When you plug a headset in the external mic and headphones become the active mic and speaker and the internal mic and speakers are mechanically disconnected.

There is no mechanical interlink between the internal speaker+microphone and the jacks for external speakers and microphones. It's all controlled by software. ALSA (and, by extension, Phonon) can listen to multiple sources and output to multiple sinks.

The only way to keep a cellphone or smartphone from being used as a spy-device by those with the proper equipment, or access to service providers equipment, is to take the batteries out of the phone, then start the super secret conversation. Put the batteries back in when the conversation is done. Turning off the cell phone doesn't guarantee a thing.

200 years ago, you and a friend could stand in a field of corn and have a completely private conversation. That is, you could rest assured that both (1) no one else eavesdropped on your conversation and (2) the fact that your conversation occurred could remain unknown to anyone else. Today, neither of these assurances is possible. Satellite imagery, infrared detection, and parabolic microphones -- to name just three technologies -- have destroyed the notion of individual privacy. I am flummoxed as to why so few people appear to give a damn about this truth.

[GreyGeek]

.. I barely use my cell phone and am not doing anything illegal, so I'm not too worried.....

YOU may think you are not doing anything wrong, but the people who have the power to charge you with a crime might think otherwise. There are so many laws and regulations on the book a zealous prosecutor could charge you with about anything, at any time, and make it stick. That's one of the biggest problems affecting the freedoms of every American.
The problem is explained here.
Don't forget to read the second part, 16B, which enumerates the problem or, rather, shows how it is impossible to enumerate the problem.

After you have read that then watch this video, which explains why you should NEVER talk to the police.

[GreyGeek]

There is no mechanical interlink between the internal speaker+microphone and the jacks for external speakers and microphones. It's all controlled by software. ALSA (and, by extension, Phonon) can listen to multiple sources and output to multiple sinks.

The socket into which a mic jack is inserted has flat metal spring with a curl at the end. That spring normally makes a connection to the other side of the socket, which is connected to the internal mic. When a mic jack is inserted the tip of the jack pushes the tip of the spring away from the internal mic connection, allowing the spring to make contact with the positive side of the jack (mono or stereo). Here is a photo of a mono jack in which the mechanical connection is plainly visible. The tip is hot (+), the sleve is ground. Stereo jacks have two springs.

200 years ago, you and a friend could stand in a field of corn and have a completely private conversation. That is, you could rest assured that both (1) no one else eavesdropped on your conversation and (2) the fact that your conversation occurred could remain unknown to anyone else. Today, neither of these assurances is possible. Satellite imagery, infrared detection, and parabolic microphones -- to name just three technologies -- have destroyed the notion of individual privacy. I am flummoxed as to why so few people appear to give a damn about this truth.

I only mentioned folks thinking their conversations were secure simply by turning off their cellphones. Spy agencies use Infrared or ultrasound to bounce a signal off a window, or the suspect's throat, and then rectify the heterodyned signal to extract the audio, even from distances approaching a couple thousand feet. I'm not sure voice conversations in a field could be eavesdropped on from a satellite ... yet.

[Feathers McGraw]

This is an interesting conversation, and it's nice to read it between people I know rather than random anonymous people on /. , so thanks OP and contributors!

Just wanted to throw into the mix that on some phones (like the Neo900) the modem is not on the same chip as other bits like WiFi, so you can truly turn it off/ isolate it from the rest of the OS if you like. From the Neo900 FAQ:

Isn't a non-free baseband firmware a privacy issue?

We're going to address privacy concerns of non-free modem firmware by ensuring that modem has access to no other data than absolutely necessary, so it won't be able to spy on anything that's not already available on carrier side. On Neo900 one can be sure that the modem is actually turned off when requested, not just pretending to be. User will be notified in case of modem wanting to do something without his consent.

Unlike some other smartphones do, Neo900 won't share system RAM with the modem and system CPU will always have full control over the microphone signal sent to the modem. You can think of it as a USB dongle connected to the PC, with you in full control over the drivers, with a virtual LED to show any modem activity.

On this N7 tablet, however, when I tell the tablet to turn off mobile data, it's just pretending to be off... and I still get texts from my service provider. For some reason that really bugs me!