Cosmos redux

[richb]

I agree, the spaceship is cartoonish and they could have done without it.

I have seen the eye used to explain evolution frequently. It is so complex that one asks how can such a complex organ be the result of small evolutionary changes? So it is an excellent choice as an explanatory tool.

I get so wrapped up in the science that editorial choices are not on my mind when I am watching. I guess I am not looking for an agenda when watching, which there very well might be, but become awed by the science,

[vw72]

There is overwhelming scientific evidence for evolution. However, specifically with the eye, there is still a lot of controversy, particularly the lens. The show actually got some stuff wrong with it, at least according to 2012 research which changed our understanding of how the lens formed. Most likely, that was because of timing when the segment was actually written to when it aired.

Tyson makes no bones that they are going after religion. In an interview, he stated that most opposition to scientific inquiry has come from organized religion. The problem with that statement is it lumps all religion into the same bucket. And yet, the facts are that the Catholic Church is the largest funder of the sciences outside of governments and public monies. Most of the craters on the moon are named after or by Jesuit priests. The father of geology was a catholic priest and the list goes on.

Tyson, in the same interview, admits that many scientists are people of faith, but you can't let faith cloud your judgement. While I agree with that statement, it also goes the other way - we can't let science cloud our judgement, either.

Science and religion do not have to be opposed to each other any more than science and any other philosophy need be opposed to each other. They both attempt to explain the human experience. Science, having to work in nature, can never prove or disprove if their is a deity, who by definition, would be outside of nature. Accepting that doesn't weaken science, but actually reinforces what science is really about.

However, when the editors of the show picked content that was intentionally antagonistic to religion, or in this politically correct world, should have been realized that it would have been antagonistic, even if not intentional, they are no longer doing science. Science, the pursuit of knowledge about the universe, is pure. Using science to encourage or manipulate people to one particular view, is something you would normally find in religion.

The show would be better served to keep church and state separated. Why pick a fight when there is no need?

[richb]

I just do not see that direct attack on religion in the show. Religious explanations of human development are completely different than evolution based explanations. They cannot help to be in conflict. So, if you are explaining your position, it inevitably comes into conflict with the other. That is the way I see the show.

Now, on the overall question of a divinity, which is not the subject of the show there is no need for a conflict between science and religion. Although avid believers either way make arguments that there is, and others can find an accommodation. So you can know my bias in this whole discussion, I cannot make that accommodation to the traditional view of a divinity.

[oshunluvr]

Well, I've not seen the show yet but maybe the scientific community wouldn't feel the need to fight back against religions if religions weren't trying to replace real science with their religious beliefs in schools. Leave religious beliefs and teachings where they belong - in the church, NOT in schools - and scientists won't fell the need to de-bunk mythical beliefs. THAT would be separation of church and state.

Full disclosure: I'm from Kansas. Where the whole Flying Spaghetti Monster was born and home of a lovely group that named themselves "God Hates Fags." I couldn't get out of there fast enough.

[woodsmoke]

I'm not "pointedly" not watching the show, I merely am not going to watch it because I teach it and I have other things to do.

woodsmoke

[charles052]

I'm not "pointedly" not watching the show, I merely am not going to watch it because I teach it and I have other things to do.

woodsmoke

If I had nothing better to do, I might've watched the show. As it is, I only watch a few select tv shows and none of them are what one would call "intellectual". But if the show does attack my Christian beliefs, I sure wouldn't watch it for long.

[charles052]

Well, I've not seen the show yet but maybe the scientific community wouldn't feel the need to fight back against religions if religions weren't trying to replace real science with their religious beliefs in schools. Leave religious beliefs and teachings where they belong - in the church, NOT in schools - and scientists won't fell the need to de-bunk mythical beliefs. THAT would be separation of church and state.

Full disclosure: I'm from Kansas. Where the whole Flying Spaghetti Monster was born and home of a lovely group that named themselves "God Hates Fags." I couldn't get out of there fast enough.

Could be worse:

http://www.examiner.com/article/ten-...te-homosexuals

http://www.christianpost.com/news/ch...ionary-115919/

http://www.thenewamerican.com/world-...benghazi-libya

I'll take the intolerance of the American people over the intolerance of other nations any day of the week.

[oshunluvr]

I'll take the intolerance of the American people over the intolerance of other nations any day of the week.

No argument here...


...and God Bless America.

[charles052]

No argument here...


...and God Bless America.

Most definitely! One thing I love about America is that if you don't like the mentality of one place, say Kansas, you can always move to another with a different mentality like California.

[oshunluvr]

Exactly!

[kubicle]

Could be worse:

http://www.examiner.com/article/ten-...te-homosexuals

http://www.christianpost.com/news/ch...ionary-115919/

http://www.thenewamerican.com/world-...benghazi-libya

I'll take the intolerance of the American people over the intolerance of other nations any day of the week.

This is kind of like saying "I'll take the Human Rights of China over the other nations because it's better than North-Korea".

If things could be worse, it doesn't mean they couldn't be better.

[SteveRiley]

Religious explanations of human development are completely different than evolution based explanations. They cannot help to be in conflict. So, if you are explaining your position, it inevitably comes into conflict with the other.

Exactly. Attempts to "harmonize" science and religion are doomed to fail. Both make claims about the nature of the universe. These claims are not compatible. They cannot both be right.

[GreyGeek]

This is kind of like saying "I'll take the Human Rights of China over the other nations because it's better than North-Korea".

I have a good friend who is living in Beijing and working as a linguist and expert in ancient chinese dialects. He's an American from Iowa who obtained his degree in China and speaks Mandarin perfectly without an accent. It stuns many native Chinese. Before they know him they often times say things about him. He says it gives him an advantage because people display their biases openly so he can often determine if an individual is friend or foe. Just like every other country racism is alive in China, but the vast majority of Chinese are friendly, as are the vast majority of Americans. He says that for the most part living in China is like living in the US, except that it is a lot more crowded and people use electric mopeds and bicycles. He is a Christian and attends one of the state approved churches there. The building seats about 2,000 people and the service is about 50 minutes long, which gives one group a chance to leave while another group enters by other doors. They do this for ten straight hours on Sunday. Ten services. There are several in the city.

So, ya, I'd live in China any day before I'd spend a second in NK.

[SteveRiley]

So, ya, I'd live in China any day before I'd spend a second in NK.

That "any day" would likely amount to about one day, given the soup they call air you'd have to breathe:

[GreyGeek]

LOL! Hey, I never said it was paradise there. I asked my friend about the air quality. He said that most of the time he (and everyone else) are indoors, but he rides his golden electric modped to his job teaching English and translating ancient Chinese texts for the museum and the air can get bad. But, he has no fears of being shot because the President has a bad day.

Of course, he and the Chinese people are spied upon by the party aparatchek, but that's not any different from NSA here, is it?