Toshiba bows out of Win8 RT tablet market

[Frank616]

While MS wants to get many manufacturers on board to support Win8 RT for tablets, it looks like one player has decided to pass for the time bing. Toshiba today announced that they are shelving plans for a Win RT tablet.

This article suggests that lack of manufacturer support may be among the reasons why MS is getting into the hardware business themselves.

Do you expect Win8 RT to get any traction? Do you use a tablet?

Frank.

[SteveRiley]

Do you expect Win8 RT to get any traction? Do you use a tablet?

1. Yes, for two reasons. Manufacturers who choose to stay with Windows will ultimately switch from Windows 7 to Windows 8. So there will come a time where customers won't be able to obtain an earlier version. Also, don't forget the fanboys.

2. A Nook, for reading books and magazines. Also a Samsung 700T, from which I purged Windows 8 months ago and replaced with Plasma Active Two. Haven't really done much else with it yet, though. It's too big and runs the fan constantly.

[Frank616]

Steve:

2. A Nook, for reading books and magazines. Also a Samsung 700T, from which I purged Windows 8 months ago and replaced with Plasma Active Two. Haven't really done much else with it yet, though. It's too big and runs the fan constantly.

So far I've kept off the tablet bandwagon. My Galaxy Note with its nice 1280 x 800 screen is enough of a tablet for my needs. I'm going to have a serious look at it's successor that is supposed to be released in another couple of weeks. That is supposed to have Jelly Bean and a quad-core processor.

I still don't see (for me, at least) a real benefit to a tablet. The software keyboards have zero feel (of course), and I am constantly checking input from the soft keyboard on my Galaxy Note -- usually two or three words too late. The Note has no cursor keys, like my Milestone 1 and 3 had (Droid 1 and 3 for the world market), and my fat fingers just seem to miss the right insertion point.

No, I'm a keyboard user. My Note is fine for consumption, and a few quick notes. But for anything else, (like replying here), I switch back to my Dell M6600, or my old desktop machine.

Frank.

[SteveRiley]

No, I'm a keyboard user. My Note is fine for consumption, and a few quick notes. But for anything else, (like replying here), I switch back to my Dell M6600, or my old desktop machine.

My (limited) tablet use has been purely for consuming information. For creating information, like you, I must have a keyboard. So I will hang onto my T-Mobile G2 for a very long time, I suspect. (There's a reason these things still command a price premium on eBay.)

[bsniadajewski]

It may get some traction with OEM's, but I'm not sure they will sell well. We'll just have to wait and see.

ANd... no, I don't own a tablet.

[Frank616]

Steve:

So I will hang onto my T-Mobile G2 for a very long time, I suspect. (There's a reason these things still command a price premium on eBay.)

That phone falls in between my Milestone 1 and Milestone 3 in specs. It does not appear to have a hardware keyboard, however, so I don't understand why you are sticking with it -- at least, not in the context of this discussion.

Frank.

[Frank616]

ANd... no, I don't own a tablet.

Nor do I, for reasons mentioned above.

I might consider something like the Asus Transformer Prime if/when we get LO and a few other 'full-size' apps for Android. In the meantime, I stick with my Galaxy Note smartphone, or my aging eeepc901 netbook. Despite its tiny 4 GB system SSD, I managed to install Kubuntu 12.04 on it, and I run one Windows app on it as well with WINE. I had VMWare Player running the Windows app with Kubuntu 8.04 on that machine, and that little Atom processor (single core but dual thread) actually did a pretty good job.

Frank.

[SteveRiley]

It does not appear to have a hardware keyboard, however, so I don't understand why you are sticking with it -- at least, not in the context of this discussion.

Perhaps you were looking at something different? I'm typing this message on my G2, and am reasonably certain I'm pressing actual buttons on a hardware keyboard

[GreyGeek]

Probably the biggest hindrance to Win8 (tablet, notebook, netbook, laptop or desktop) adoption will be the unwillingness of corporations to move to it. Most of them are still moving to Win7. Moving to Win8 so soon after moving to Win7 would be too expensive and time consuming.

And, I suspect that Toshiba won't be the only OEM to say "No, Thanks" to the Win8 Tablet and continue to peddle Win7.

[oshunluvr]

It will be interesting to see how much MS will push vendors. Maybe MS releasing their own tab is a sign hardware manufacturers are already looking to other (Android?) OS's.

I wonder how many customer service complaints (and therefore the dollars spent to service these issues) are actually caused by Windows rather than actual hardware complaints. Dell, HP, and your_brand_here have to keep huge staffs of people trained on Windoze just to keep their customers happy. What if Microsoft actually had to service these complaints? Maybe they'd put out a better product.

These hardware makers might have an officer or two who have been around enough to see the idea that an OS they could control that already has a huge support base available for free might be a viable and more profitable option.

I agree with GG that it will really be decided in the corporate IT departments. My small (350ish employees) already has to go through a couple "License Verification" processes every year or we get threatened with lawsuits. It boggles my mind that my COO/CFO puts up with it rather than moving wholly to linux. Especially since we use linux in our products - but not on our desks.

As far as tablets go - I find the varying opinions interesting as to whether or not they are perceived as useful. As I've mentioned before, I find laptops utterly annoying. More so since a tablet has made it's way into my household. I guess the key is, as Frank mentioned, "Consumption" rather than "Creation" aka work. For me - a laptop is best for neither and rather is a compromise between the two main uses for a computer. In my world the best setup is a solid high-performance desktop for work and a tablet for pure consumption. I guess I would have to include a smart phone for communication and a "cloud" service for data mobility. All running linux, of course

[SteveRiley]

My small (350ish employees) already has to go through a couple "License Verification" processes every year or we get threatened with lawsuits.

Who's making the threats?

[Frank616]

Steve:

Perhaps you were looking at something different?

That is a distinct probability. It would appear that the G2 and the G2x are not the same device.

Now, if Samsung would just make us a Note with a hardware keyboard.... I love the keyboard on my Motorola Milestone 3 aka Droid 3 aka XT-860. FIVE row keyboard with dedicated number keys and cursor keys as well. But, alas, it seems no one is making new phones with hardware keyboards anymore.

Frank.

[Frank616]

oshunluvr:

Dell, HP, and your_brand_here have to keep huge staffs of people trained on Windoze just to keep their customers happy. What if Microsoft actually had to service these complaints? Maybe they'd put out a better product.

Agreed. However, this is the same with any OS that non technical users are supposed to work with. I just read an interesting interview with Allison Randall, Technical Architect for Ubuntu, in the July issue of Linux Format. Usability is what Canonical is big on, and they are investing a lot of money and time in Unity to find out what is intuitive to non-technical users. One of her observations is that as your user base grows, you get more and more clueless people that need hand holding, no matter what you give them to work with. I'm not defending MS, but everyone faces the same problem eventually.

"Consumption" rather than "Creation" aka work. For me - a laptop is best for neither and rather is a compromise between the two main uses for a computer. In my world the best setup is a solid high-performance desktop for work and a tablet for pure consumption.

I have been of that mindset up until recently as well. I still have my desktop machine, and I still like it a lot, even though it is getting old. I have a swappable hard drive bay for testing new distros, and an internal 1.5 TB drive for my data. However, I am finding that my rather high-end Dell M6600 is my workhorse machine nowadays. I don't do engineering or gaming, so this machine may be overkill for me. But unless one is REALLY pushing the hardware, a good laptop I find to be a convenient and viable alternative.

For me to go to a tablet, I would need something like the Asus Transformer Prime, or at the very least, a bluetooth keyboard that I could use with a tablet. However, that also presupposes, like you say, that the tablet run Linux, or, at the very least, Android with some full-size apps. LO is working at an Android port, but it is not there yet.

In the meantime, I just don't see a need for a tablet. For me it is large and powerful 'laptop' and large and powerful smartphone that gives me what I need.

Frank.

[GreyGeek]

...
It boggles my mind that my COO/CFO puts up with it rather than moving wholly to linux. Especially since we use linux in our products - but not on our desks.

I began my career in computers in 1959, when I took a night class in "data processing" at the Barnes School of Business in Denver, CO, right after I graduated from HS. I was taught to use the 540 Gangpunch, to "program" the 402 Tabulator (breadboard and banana wires), and the sorter-collator (I forget its model #). It was called "heavy iron" because the 402 was big and it was heavy. I graduated with a 95% grade but couldn't land a job because I looked too young. The only lesson that sticks with me 52 years later was that "no one every got fired for recommending IBM". Right now, that appears to be the maxim that most IT departments follow, except that IBM was replaced by Windows.


Microsoft has failed to establish a significant beachhead in the smartphone market and they have NO presence in the tablet market. They've angered their OEM by directly competing against them by introducing the Surface Tablet. Microsoft has all but told them to their face that their survival is immaterial to Microsoft's interests. But, Microsoft's only remaining dominance is on the very platform (Desktop and laptop) that most consumers are fleeing in favor of smartphones and tablets. Thankfully, corporate requirements will keep the OEMs making laptops and desktops for several more years. My new Acer V3-771G "should" last for at least five years. By then, all this current mess (political, economic, electronic) should be fairly well sorted out. My only question is "will I even care by then?"

[oshunluvr]

Who's making the threats?

To be totally accurate: We employees are given strongly worded directions by our IT manager to verify all our licenses twice a year or so. It mostly has to do with Microsoft 365, Office and Microsoft Credentials. Here's a quote from last month's emails:

We are being audited by Microsoft and have to show proof of our licenses we currently hold. This includes but is not limited to Office, Visio, Project, Server and SQL. I have kept in my possession every license I have come in contact with which I am going to put together for the audit. If anyone has any licenses in a drawer put away I would like to place them with the package. Once the audit is over they will all be returned. Any gaps we have in physical licenses and usage is going to cost ****** to fill. Thank you for your help.

Here is an example of the packaging for Office 2007 Professional.

They also remind us not to install software to our work computers not owned by us or them (a good practice in my opinion). In my case, I keep all my own personal software choices on my dual boot partition. Which boots to...guess?