Why it takes a whole day to install & update Windows

[GreyGeek]

Re: Why it takes a whole day to install & update Windows

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@GG - a retail Windows install is one thing, a preloaded Windows quite another.

You're absolutely right. Pre-loading is an advantage that the MS monopoly has on the PC OEM desktop. But, my wife's Acer Aspire, which was preloaded by Acer, took about four hours and several reboots to "finish". In the past I've never installed a pre-loaded Windows that took less than four hours, to say nothing of taking just five minutes. Microsoft or Acer has significantly changed their pre-loading setup.

[SteveRiley]

Re: Why it takes a whole day to install & update Windows

After 20 minutes of searching I still couldn't find an OpenJDK JRE for WINDOWS which I would trust, so I reverted to Sun's latest JRE. That's the first time I had trouble finding a Windows version of some software.

Apparently Oracle is relying on OS distributors to create binaries of Open JDK/JRE. It took a while, but I found this -- http://jdk7.java.net/java-se-7-ri/ -- which includes Java 7 reference implementation binaries under the GNU license and under the Oracle license. Ordinarily I'd recommend using Oracle's supported binaries instead, because I know these include an automatic update mechanism. Given the spate of ongoing Java vulnerabilities, auto-updates are a good thing. I don't know whether the reference binaries include auto-updates; but since this is your own PC which I know you'll take good care of, perhaps auto-updates aren't as important for you.

You're absolutely right. Pre-loading is an advantage that the MS monopoly has on the PC OEM desktop. But, my wife's Acer Aspire, which was preloaded by Acer, took about four hours and several reboots to "finish". In the past I've never installed a pre-loaded Windows that took less than four hours, to say nothing of taking just five minutes. Microsoft or Acer has significantly changed their pre-loading setup.

Is there any cruft-ware on your shiny new Acer, or is it a pure vanilla install?

[SteveRiley]

Re: Why it takes a whole day to install & update Windows

This one is not mine, it's a paraphrase - you have a whole industry designed around the notion that the "solution" that detects the most threats is deemed the most trustworthy. And there are several ways in which you can make your solution detect the most threats...

Indeed. This is why I don't grant much credence to AV reports. A tally of total reported threats is a number that lacks context and is rather useless for risk assessment.

[ScottyK]

Re: Why it takes a whole day to install & update Windows

I just finished doing the monthly update of the windows 7 side of my desktop. I have a few games I play occasionally, so I keep windows around.

What annoys me is after not getting an internet connection for a while, EVERYTHING wants to phone home and update itself. Adobe reader, Flash, Java, the browsers, AV, then finally the window updates themselves.

On the kubuntu side I noticed I had a few updates, so I brought my wife over to see the computer, and to see the little update icon in the bottom right.

I explained to her that it would update everything on the system, and at my convenience. No popups nagging me to update, to "update then shutdown" nonsense, I was in control of the computer.

I love the system that Linux uses! Everything in once nice to get place. No popups nagging me to update.

She was impressed, and tonight she moved just a little bit closer to using Linux. Baby steps!

[de_koraco]

Re: Why it takes a whole day to install & update Windows

As far as computer security is concerned, Marcus Ranum's Six Dumbest Ideas are still quite valid.

[GreyGeek]

Re: Why it takes a whole day to install & update Windows

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Is there any cruft-ware on your shiny new Acer, or is it a pure vanilla install?

It came preloaded with Bing, (bang, gone!), Ebay (now sunk), Norton (RIP) and IE9 (which is holding Win7 hostage). I haven't remove "clear.fi", yet, and I haven't even looked at "Acer Games" to see if it has anything I want to play.

What amazes me most is how desperate the AV vendors are getting. When visiting sites looking for OpenJDK for Windows, and for CCleaner, I had to manually uncheck options to install Norton, Avast, Semantec, and others, before I could download. While to removing the Norton "trial" it cleverly tried to install AOL and Yahoo by using reverse logic. When I updated FlashPlayer, because version 10 wouldn't work on many sites I tested, Adobe tried to install Norton, again, and Yahoo, IIRC. Even downloading FireFox was tricky if one wanted to avoid installing those AV apps. They are more prevalent malware than the stuff the bad guys write. The sooner they die the better.

[Detonate]

Re: Why it takes a whole day to install & update Windows

Yes, even our old friend Ccleaner tries to install a toolbar.

[GreyGeek]

Re: Why it takes a whole day to install & update Windows

Yes, even our old friend Ccleaner tries to install a toolbar.

Yup, but I didn't let it get away with that. The desktop icon is good enough.

[ScottyK]

Re: Why it takes a whole day to install & update Windows

Got a call late last night from a good friend of mine. His wife's computer got hit with the "Win 7 Antivirus 2012" and he told me that Linux was suddenly starting to look good. I'll hook him up next week, and we'll have another convert on our hands!

GG - thanks for the reminder about all the crap programs. I'm updating the college daughter's notebook right now, time to go in and remove that crap!

[sithlord48]

Re: Why it takes a whole day to install & update Windows

use spybot search and destroy.
http://www.safer-networking.org/en/index.html

no toolbars. no extra garbage. seriously if you need to clean spyware try spybot you won't be disapointed.

[GreyGeek]

Re: Why it takes a whole day to install & update Windows

use spybot search and destroy.
http://www.safer-networking.org/en/index.html

no toolbars. no extra garbage. seriously if you need to clean spyware try spybot you won't be disapointed.

I've used, and used to install Spybot, but MSE works well and is automatically updated. Spybot is an "after the fact" tool, i.e., it doesn't monitor incoming streams for threats the way MSE does.

[ardvark71]

Re: Why it takes a whole day to install & update Windows

In the past I've never installed a pre-loaded Windows that took less than four hours, to say nothing of taking just five minutes.

Hi GreyGeek...

Nor have I on a pre-loaded system, not counting reinstalls. I find the situation with your wife's laptop very bizarre.

Regards...

[PhilT]

Re: Why it takes a whole day to install & update Windows

An old friend of mine had a severely corrupted Dell Inspiron 6000. I was tempted to "convert" her to Kubuntu but her very old habits were too ingrained and I didn't want to be "on call" forever.[I like Windows, my dear! I'm used to it|]. She had wanted to chuck her machine away because it took about 5 minutes to load XP and was "very slow" as she put it. So I offered to "clean it up" for her. I looked at the disk using GParted (live) and discovered that some "crap" in her system had rewritten the disk The 38Gb was now showing a small boot sector, then 29GB of unmounted, unused, empty space and the remainder (about 9 GB containing all of Windows programs and all her data with about 1MB of free space!. No wonder it was so slow! I do not have any idea how it got so corrupted, but following the advice in these forums I thought that nothing short of total blitz was going to be acceptable (residual MBR rootkits, BIOS corruption possibilities etc., etc.).

I copied her data to an external USB HD, removed, shredded and re-formatted all the drive partitions, downloaded all the 30-or-so "special" drivers needed to integrate the Dell "lack-of-hardware" with XP (from the Dell website - via my Kubuntu box), re-flashed her BIOS (updated from Dell) then re-loaded XP, then set about installing all those drivers, then programs, then ....... Well, the whole exercise took nearly 2 days! I've installed all the "good" stuff like CCleaner etc. but will now put in MSE as recommended by GG.

As you can imagine, she is pleased. Her machine boots up now in less than a minute and is "flying" so to speak - "Oh, that's nice; I don't need to buy a new computer then?"

But, what a miserable business that was compared to a 30 minute "total" Kubuntu install into a vanilla machine with the kernel finding all the drivers it needs all by itself.

If Windows really had to compete on a level playing field it would be dead (or at least dying!).

I am truly amazed at the commercial junk, the endless pop-ups, the relentless irrelevant "offers", the blind alleys and check-boxes you have to navigate to avoid all that rubbish out there. How could anyone ever choose Windows if they had a free and un-biased look at the alternatives.

[Detonate]

Re: Why it takes a whole day to install & update Windows

Yesterday I upgraded my wife's machine with a new MB and processor. She is set up with a dual boot of Linux mint and Win XP. After installing the new MB and i5 processor the machine booted up to her Mint install with no problems. Of course, her XP install is borked. Going to have to reinstall.

[Detonate]

Re: Why it takes a whole day to install & update Windows

On second thought, as I have to reinstall XP anyway, I believe it is time to introduce her to the world of virtual computing.