Bye Bye Skype for Linux?

[GreyGeek]

Re: Bye Bye Skype for Linux?

....
It appears in RPM form for Fedora, and also CentOS and SUSE. It's not in the downloaded Brosix tarball. I've got a feeling it's a "64-bit" problem.

I am running the 64bit Kubuntu Lucid Lynx. Brosix was written using the Qt4 API. liboil is in the latest Qt-SDK. I suspect that you could download and install the version for your archetecthure and then make a link in /usr/lib to ~/QtSDK/Maemo/4.6.2/sysroots/fremantle-arm-sysroot-20.2010.36-2-slim/usr/lib/liboil-0.3.so.0.3.0

[dibl]

Re: Bye Bye Skype for Linux?

Brosix was written using the Qt4 API. liboil is in the latest Qt-SDK. I suspect that you could download and install the version for your archetecthure and then make a link in /usr/lib to ~/QtSDK/Maemo/4.6.2/sysroots/fremantle-arm-sysroot-20.2010.36-2-slim/usr/lib/liboil-0.3.so.0.3.0

I like your theory! I'll try it.

BTW, I checked my Kubuntu Natty installation, and that liboil package is not present there either (nor is the qt-sdk package).

[GreyGeek]

Re: Bye Bye Skype for Linux?

There are both 32 and 64 bit versions on my system. Here is an rdepends listing...

/usr/lib$ apt-cache rdepends liboil0.3
liboil0.3
Reverse Depends:
gstreamer0.10-plugins-bad
psimedia
gstreamer0.10-plugins-good
swfdec-mozilla
swfdec-gnome
python-vipscc
psimedia
nip2
mitools
lives
libvips15
libvips-tools
libswfdec-0.8-0
libswfdec-0.7-1
libquicktime1
gstreamer0.10-plugins-ugly
gstreamer0.10-plugins-bad
gstreamer0.10-fluendo-mp3
gstreamer0.10-ffmpeg
libschroedinger-1.0-0
liboil0.3-dev
liboil0.3-dbg
gstreamer0.10-plugins-good
gstreamer0.10-plugins-base

Maybe adding one of those to your system may pull the library out of the nether regions.

[kubicle]

Re: Bye Bye Skype for Linux?

BTW, I checked my Kubuntu Natty installation, and that liboil package is not present there either (nor is the qt-sdk package).

I'm on oneiric, but checked the natty repos, liboil0.3 (and qt-sdk) are both available in universe, do you have it enabled?

[dibl]

Re: Bye Bye Skype for Linux?

Well .... I dunno. I do find the file /usr/lib/liboil-0.3.so.0.3.0. But that is not quite what Brosix is complaining about. It says:

don@aptosidbox:~/Brosix$ ./Brosix
<program name unknown>: error while loading shared libraries: liboil-0.3.so.0: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory

Both Debian sid and Natty show it:

don@natty-vm:/$ sudo find . -type f -name "liboil-0.3.so.0.3.0"
./usr/lib/liboil-0.3.so.0.3.0
don@natty-vm:/$

For fun, I copied that file into the user's ~/Brosix directory and changed the owner to the user. That didn't help. It may be that Brosix really needs to be installed normally, in the root filesystem, rather than under the user's folder. Whaddaya think?

[kubicle]

Re: Bye Bye Skype for Linux?

Well .... I dunno. I do find the file /usr/lib/liboil-0.3.so.0.3.0. But that is not quite what Brosix is complaining about. It says:

don@aptosidbox:~/Brosix$ ./Brosix
<program name unknown>: error while loading shared libraries: liboil-0.3.so.0: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory

That looks like a case of missing symlink:
lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root /usr/lib/liboil-0.3.so.0 -> liboil-0.3.so.0.3.0
-rw-r--r-- 1 root root /usr/lib/liboil-0.3.so.0.3.0

[dibl]

Re: Bye Bye Skype for Linux?

Mehh -- Kubicle I thought you nailed it for me! But

don@aptosidbox:/usr/lib$ ls -la | more
.
.
.
lrwxrwxrwx  1 root root      19 Aug 18 2010 liboil-0.3.so.0 -> liboil-0.3.so.0.3.0
-rw-r--r--  1 root root    578848 Aug 18 2010 liboil-0.3.so.0.3.0

[kubicle]

Re: Bye Bye Skype for Linux?

I downloaded Brosix to test, and it starts ok for me with Brosix just untarred to a user directory. So I can't really tell why it errors on your end.

(I don't use skype, nor will I start using Brosix, but looks like a decent replacement...just as closed and propietary, but linux friendly)

[dibl]

Re: Bye Bye Skype for Linux?

Thanks Kubicle. I downloaded it to Natty and you are correct -- it fires right up. I dunno what the deal is with debian. I'll see what I can do with it on the Natty system.

Thanks again.

[GreyGeek]

Re: Bye Bye Skype for Linux?

A Brosix report!

Dibl and I connected via Brosix's local client and later via their browser interface. This a summary of what we discovered.

My laptop has Intel video and sound chips. Dible was running Natty as a VM guest OS.

I was able to send my sound and video to him. He could hear and see me. But, because he was running Natty as a guest OS, Brosix didn't see Natty's sound or video as being Intel chips, so while he could see and hear me I could neither see nor hear him.

1) Screen sharing -- AWESOME! (Apparently the Intel requirement is only for video and sound) Easy to start or stop, easy to use.

2) Remote Screen control -- DOUBLY AWESOME! On the screen sharing mini dialog is a middle button offering the user a chance to convert screen sharing into remote control of his mouse and keyboard. It can work either way very easily. Dibl's Brosix crashed while we were connected. He was able to get it back up so fast I couldn't tell it had crashed. The connection seemed to be seamless, without interruption. Dible and I took turns controlling the other's computer remotely. Easy as pie. Very little delay. This alone makes Brosix a valuable tool for remote support of my Linux users. I am going to use Skype to talk them through downloading and unpacking Brosix, then adding a menu entry. After that I'll use the remote access capability of Brosix to remove Skype from their box.

An aside: IF Microsoft's past behavior is any guide, I suspect that they will continue to make improvements in the Windows version of Skype, perhaps less so for the Mac version, but will let the Linux version lag to the point that people will abandon it... all in an attempt to force them away from Linux and back to Windows. Bosix circumvents that ploy. Will Microsoft attempt to influence or buy Brosix to hinder its support of Linux and Mac? I suspect so. That's why Ekiga is my backup plan.

3) Text Chat -- typical of the genre. Seen one and you've seen them all. I took a screen shot and sent it to him so file send and recieve worked great, which is something GMail's Chat does not have, IIRC.

4) Brosix's web client is only a chat tool. No other features are visible on the web page. IF you leave their local client running and fire up their web tool, found here, it will disconnect the local client. When you close your browser and try to start the local client it will tell you that another connection is running. You have to close Brosix and restart it..

Brosix Web Client runs in a web browser. You don’t have to install the Brosix application, which makes it handy if you want to get in touch with your colleagues and friends from a public computer. Brosix Web Client leaves no traces of activity and no personal information on the computer. It employs the same high level encryption and security as other Brosix applications.

IOW, great for chatting from a library. You still have to log into your Brosix account, which is free for personal use.

The feature list for the free version is here. What is missing from the Free version are these features:

Own IM Network
Web Control Panel
Features Control
Manage Users
Users Activity Log
Technical Support

Which probably explains why the Free version of the web client is only a simple chat tool. I suspect that if you purchased the proprietary version you'd have the same controls (via Java applets) on the web client that the Free local client has.

5) Brosix does NOT have PC --> phone capability, like Blink and Ekiga have.

This is a brief summary of what Dibl and I discovered during our 30 minute experiment. We didn't test everything, but we tested the important bits.

Conclusion: Brosix is more than capable of replacing Skype on Linux. In fact, IMO, it is better than Skype.

For PC --> phone connections we have Blink and Ekiga. Both have their peculiarities, for PC --> phone Blink has an edge over Ekiga, IMO. IF using your computer to make CHEAP telephone calls (2.4 cents/min in the US and most 1st world countries) isn't something you have a need for, but you want to see who you are talking to, then Ekiga is your app. Blink's video capabilities in in the TODO list, and they've created the structure for video codecs in the settings dialog, but that dialog has no video codecs installed yet. IF Blink gets video capability relatively soon then it is my choice for VIOP/Phone app. Did I mention that Blink was built using Qt4?

[arochester]

Re: Bye Bye Skype for Linux?

now everyone must decide on how best to get the same one

- The Liquidator

Should everyone just get a SIP account? There are many and various clients, but they work *through* SIP. I investigated this a few years ago and the client that worked best for me (and the ugliest!) was Twinkle.

Some SIP clients support audio, others audio and video. There might be a "problem" knowing who can support what.

My SIP address is 1249732@sipgate.co.uk GG should be able to contact me...but I don't think he can use one of his SIP addresses to contact another of his SIP addresses. (Should a space for SIP addresses be made in the Profile)

I shall be sticking with Skype until it does (if it does) stop. (Don't count your chickens until they're hatched. Don't cross your bridges until you come to them etc.) Best way of communicating with my youngest daughter in Beijing, China.

There has been an Open Source alternative to Skype announced but I think it has a long way to go yet - http://planet.gnu.org/gnutelephony/?p=14

[GreyGeek]

Re: Bye Bye Skype for Linux?

now everyone must decide on how best to get the same one

- The Liquidator

Should everyone just get a SIP account? There are many and various clients, but they work *through* SIP. I investigated this a few years ago and the client that worked best for me (and the ugliest!) was Twinkle.

I installed Twinkle but could not get it to register with either ekiga.net because Twinkle's registration screen wasn't compatible with the Ekiga's required info. Gizmo5 failed for the same reason.

Some SIP clients support audio, others audio and video. There might be a "problem" knowing who can support what.

True. What will probably happen is that a particular users will use what is mutually satisfying to them, be it Skype, QuteCom, Twinkle, Blink, Brosix, Ekiga, etc. In most cases Ekiga, with registration at both ekiga.net and diamondcard.us, would allow the best of all possibilities, until Blink gets video. All but Skype and Brosix are GPL'd.

My SIP address is 1249732@sipgate.co.uk GG should be able to contact me...but I don't think he can use one of his SIP addresses to contact another of his SIP addresses. (Should a space for SIP addresses be made in the Profile)

My SIP addresses are
GreyGeek@sip2sip.info
GreyGeek@ekiga.net
and GreyGeek within Brosix. (No outside access possible.)

You're right. I tried that yesterday after I had registered with both Diamoncard.us and ekiga.net. Since both connections began and ended with my single IP address the call was aborted immediately. "Connection closed by remote user", IIRC.

I cannot contact you using your sip at sipgate.co.uk unless I register with sipgate.co.uk and create an account with that SIP server. Besides the fact that Skypes SIP servers were private and proprietary, that is why no one can call a skype SIP with a non-skype client - you can register for a skype account with a browser, but you can only connect with a Skype client app. IF two or more people want to connect via VOIP they have to agree beforehand to create their accounts at a particular service provider. The choice of client isn't too much of an issue IF it has text boxes in its registration dialog for all the information the service requires.

Ekiga, for example, has an option in the setup dialog to register a Diamondcard.us server. To do that the user is presented with two text boxes, one for the Acct ID and one for the "Pin Code". Both are numbers which are assigned when the user registers and pays the minimum fee, in the case of Ekiga - $15 US, for Blink -- $23.80. IF one does not want to use the PC --> phone capability they bypass the Diamondcard registration and create/register an account on the ekiga.net server. Blink is coded to link to sip2sip.info.
I've tried to use Ekiga to link to sip2sip.info but it doesn't have the "ID" & "Pen #" fields. Blink doesn't offer the fields necessary to register with Ekiga.net. So, running Ekiga, because it is GPL, I still have to make sure Ekiga's registration dialog offers all that some server requires.

I shall be sticking with Skype until it does (if it does) stop. (Don't count your chickens until they're hatched. Don't cross your bridges until you come to them etc.) Best way of communicating with my youngest daughter in Beijing, China.
...

I have a friend whose son has spent four years in China studying their language. He just started his graduate work there in Peking. When he comes home for a visit he speaks English with a chinese accent.
His mom and dad use Skype to connect with him at least once a week or more. It would be prohibitively expensive to make that call via corporate phone connections.

[dibl]

Re: Bye Bye Skype for Linux?

@GG, can you tell whether Brosix has a "conference" mode, similar to Skype? I can't find it.

[GreyGeek]

Re: Bye Bye Skype for Linux?

@GG, can you tell whether Brosix has a "conference" mode, similar to Skype? I can't find it.

http://www.brosix.com/features/video-chat/

You can open several video sessions at the same time with different people. The only restriction in this case is the bandwidth of your Internet connection.

http://www.brosix.com/features/whiteboard/

Used together with the other Brosix tools Whiteboard is very effective method for presentations.

My assumption here would be that one could open a WhiteBoard and share his/her screen with several others because you can open several video sessions AT THE SAME TIME with different people.

In several ways we didn't begin to scratch the surface of Brosix beyond one-on-one communication.

[GreyGeek]

Re: Bye Bye Skype for Linux?

.....
My SIP address is 1249732@sipgate.co.uk GG should be able to contact me..
....

Arochester, I tried to register at your SIP provider but they only have UK phone numbers (even though free) and I didn't want a UK phone number. "Other countries" will follow soon. I did notice that their rates in and into the US was only 1.5 per minute. US pennies British pence