Sudo is patented by Microsoft

[Ole Juul]

Yes, sudo as a concept has been around since 1971, but that doesn't mean that the USPO won't give a patent to the right applicant.

Systems and/or methods are described that enable a user to elevate his or her rights. In one embodiment, these systems and/or methods present a user interface identifying an account having a right to permit a task in response to the task being prohibited based on a user's current account not having that right

That was filed yesterday. Instead of going on about it, I'll just give an excellent link to Groklaw: http://www.groklaw.net/article.php?s...91111094923390

[MoonRise]

Re: Sudo is patented by Microsoft

I really have to say that the Patent Office must employee idiots.

[monte48lowes]

Re: Sudo is patented by Microsoft

I am submitting a patent for a glass of water.

Mike

[dibl]

Re: Sudo is patented by Microsoft

I'm not at all religious, but (by God) I'm going to say a prayer for the Supreme Court justices tonight!

[GreyGeek]

Re: Sudo is patented by Microsoft

#1) Microsoft KNOWS the complete history of SUDO. They patented a GUI form of it anyway. Only a company run by EVIL people would do that.

#2) The USTPO is bought and paid for, otherwise they'd do prior art research and kill crap like this. But, they make MONEY for each patent they register and with the encouragement of EVIL corporations they are allowing LAWSUITS to "sort" things out. Translation: Those with the most bucks end up owning everything.

And they wonder why piracy exists?

Patenting software does not promote "innovation", as this patent proves. It's only purpose is to be used as a hammer to bludgeon the poor, the less wealthy and small corporations/SOHO into the ground.

It is absolutely NO different than if a thug came to your house accompanied, by a sheriff, with a piece of paper signed by a judge which claims the thug owns your house. You get charged with theft and convicted, or are forced to pay rent to the thug for living in your own house.

Microsoft isn't the only company pulling this kind of crap. MOST of corporate America is full of lairs and thieves, as the recent economic crisis has so patently revealed.

[sithlord48]

Re: Sudo is patented by Microsoft

The program was originally written by Bob Coggeshall and Cliff Spencer "around 1980"
at the Department of Computer Science at SUNY/Buffalo. The current version is under active development and is maintained by OpenBSD developer Todd C Miller and distributed under a BSD-style license.

how can you patent something you had nothing to do with>?

[Snowhog]

Re: Sudo is patented by Microsoft

Simple. If it isn't already patented, and can be, anyone submitting a patent application can obtain the patent.

[pansz]

Re: Sudo is patented by Microsoft

how can you patent something you had nothing to do with

patent doesn't protect entities, it protect ideas.

MS patent the idea in 1971, and the author of sudo write the software in 1980.

Now it is 2009 and I think most patent should have expired. (AFAIK patent will not be more than 15 years...)

I wonder what is the point of an expired patent?

[kubicle]

Re: Sudo is patented by Microsoft

patent doesn't protect entities, it protect ideas.

Usually (although I'm not familiar with the strange patent system in the U.S.) patents do not protect ideas, but only the technical implementation of an idea. You can't patent "cure for cancer", you can only patent a specific "drug molecule" to cure cancer.

MS patent the idea in 1971, and the author of sudo write the software in 1980

This patent application was filed in 2005, not 1971.

Simple. If it isn't already patented, and can be, anyone submitting a patent application can obtain the patent.

I think is only true in the U.S., in most countries the patent has to be new (the technology must not be in use prior to the patent claim) even to accept the patent. Still, even in the U.S., such patents are invalid if tested (in a court). http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prior_art

---
All companies like to gather as many patents as they can into their IP-portfolios, this really is nothing new. That does not mean all such patents are valid or can be enforced. Even though MS could get a valid patent on it's own implementation of "something similar to sudo" it would have no valid patent claim over sudo on *nix systems.

[Ole Juul]

Re: Sudo is patented by Microsoft

You are not supposed to be able to patent something which has been done before. For example you cannot patent pants or shoes. The patent office is supposed to check if there is prior art but the problem is they have neither the time nor expertise to do this - and have said as much. The result is they basically accept most applications and then assume the courts will sort it out. That would seem OK until you realize that the courts are not available to most people - such as FOSS coders. It simply costs too much money to fight a patent case. In fact I think the current estimate is around 1.5 million dollars. So effectively someone with that kind of spare change (like Microsoft) can bully those that find it a little difficult to come up with that much without cutting into their grocery money. However, assuming that money is no object, it is completely democratic.

[Ole Juul]

Re: Sudo is patented by Microsoft

Re: 1971
I had mentioned the 1971 date in my original posting because a Steve Martin had pointed out that the idea could be found in the XDS Sigma 7 UTS Reference manual (1971), Appendix B. This is just something that he knows about, it is not a guarantee that there is not a still earlier reference which could also be relevant.

PS: Thanks for the clarity kubicle, it seems like there is some confusion about the basic concepts. If anyone is interested in some of the problems with "intellectual monopolies", a point of view which is becoming more prevalent because of filings such as the one under discussion, here is an interesting site: http://www.dklevine.com/general/inte...againstnew.htm

[kubicle]

Re: Sudo is patented by Microsoft

That would seem OK until you realize that the courts are not available to most people - such as FOSS coders.

The cost of going to court is indeed a problem (especially in the U.S), although most of the world don't recognize software patents at all, but there are some big names with money to spare behind FOSS software (like IBM and RedHat, for example)...There are also a number of organizations that fight bogus patent claims and can provide monetary/legal assistance in such cases.

Patent portfolios are generally used as negotiation leverage ("you can use all these patents of ours if we can use yours"), in which case you need a lot of patents, whether they all are valid or not. Going to court is usually the last resort, and any company would be hesitant to go to court with a case they know they'll lose (in most of the world, the loser will have to pay the costs of the winner).

[andybleaden]

Re: Sudo is patented by Microsoft

I will have to patent the word 'patent' then >

[Jook_roberts]

Re: Sudo is patented by Microsoft

I just read this and can't believe it. How can M$ patent something from the 70's. Isn't there a limit on the age of prior art? I think I will patent a stone tied to a stick and call it a hammer.

[GreyGeek]

Re: Sudo is patented by Microsoft

how can you patent something you had nothing to do with

patent doesn't protect entities, it protect ideas.

MS patent the idea in 1971, and the author of sudo write the software in 1980.

Now it is 2009 and I think most patent should have expired. (AFAIK patent will not be more than 15 years...)

I wonder what is the point of an expired patent?

Your information is not correct. Microsoft count NOT have patented SUDO, or the "idea" of it, in 1971 for the simple reason it did not exist in 1971. Here is a brief history of Microsoft:

July 22, 1975

Paul Allen and Bill Gates sign a licensing agreement with MITS regarding the Basic Interpreter. The name Microsoft has not yet been chosen, and Microsoft is not yet an official partnership.

July 29, 1975

In a letter to Paul Allen, Bill Gates uses the name "Micro-soft" to refer to their partnership. This is the earliest known written reference.

December 31, 1975

The 1975 year-end sales total equals 16,005 dollars, as detailed on Form 1065 U.S. Partnership Return of Income.

The purpose of a software patent is to use the Law to lock out superior technology (& competition) in order to maximise PROFITS on existing technology without having to improve it. Thus, for example, while the rest of the world has gone to Fiber Optics and give their citizens 10-40Gb/s connections for under $40 US, the cable and telcos in the US "innovate" by bribing Congress to force the FCC to allow multi-tracking copper wire at ever increasing prices. So now, I pay $70 US for a measly 10Mb/s connection while a Fiber Optic cable has rested unused for 15 years under my lawn, blocked by the law which Congress passed to prevent "competition" from local governments and which authorised a $200 BILLION gift to the cable and telcos to complete the Fiber Optic network. They took the money and it disappeared down the rat-hole of management bonuses and stock-holder dividends. The FO network was never built because Congress, in its infinite wisdom (or because it was BRIBED NOT TO) did NOT include any performance or penalty clauses.

Now, a telco can compare their Internet connection to a green 1950 Ford truck, claiming it has been "fasterized" and charging "only" $50/mon for a first tier DSL connection. A first tier DSL has only 1.5Mb/s, which is about 1/20,000th the speed of Japanese, Korean and European Fiber Optic Internet connections. If US DSL users paid in proportion they'd have to pay $1M/mon for a 30Gb/s Internet connection.