Announcement

**GreyGeek** · Oct 01, 2009, 09:22 AM

Re: Mark Shuttleworth's keynote at LinuxCon

Originally posted by josefko

.... three neutral words instead of mom, gradmom and girl, ...

When and how did "girl", "mom" and "grandmom" become offensive? I must have missed that memo.

**Telengard** · Oct 01, 2009, 09:55 AM

Re: Mark Shuttleworth's keynote at LinuxCon

Originally posted by GreyGeek

When and how did "girl", "mom" and "grandmom" become offensive? I must have missed that memo.

IMHO, Shuttleworth's error is one of omission. His list specifies females. That makes it possible for the listener to assume (erroneously) that only females lack the competence to help themselves.

This is a good example of allowing one's own (probably unconscious) bias to spoil an otherwise important and worthwhile work.
Although I think any fair minded, objective observer can see that Shuttleworth made a silly mistake, and clearly meant no harm to anyone, he is still responsible for how he conducts himself. Public speakers should learn to explain their ideas clearly without allowing clumsy language to muddle the topic of discussion.

**MetalHellsAngel** · Oct 01, 2009, 11:47 AM

Re: Mark Shuttleworth's keynote at LinuxCon

I just finished watching the stream of Mark speaking Here http://techcast.com/events/linuxcon/shuttleworth/ and I must say for the I don't see any problem with his use of "Guys" throughout his talk, it seems to me it was used as I myself would probably use this term.

My thinking is that "then we'll have less trouble explaining to girls what we actually do" probably was him referring to the "girls" he just spoke of "mom" "grandma" but as some one who is speaking publicly he should have replaced "girls" with either "people" or "end users" Because the way he phrased it, to me as a techy geeky female myself I was also bit offended.

**Telengard** · Oct 01, 2009, 01:22 PM

Re: Mark Shuttleworth's keynote at LinuxCon

Originally posted by Mrs_Angel_D

Because the way he phrased it, to me as a techy geeky female myself I was also bit offended.

Thanks for the video link.

I was more disappointed by him checking his watch and using crude euphemisms (e.g. happy release.) If he gave that speech in college I think he would be lucky to earn a C.

Since this is my third post in this thread, I will offer one personal anecdote which I believe exemplifies my feelings on women in technology. The single brightest, most intelligent, and most capable engineer I ever met was a woman in her early twenties. The former partner in a successful chain of computer stores, she dropped out of college because she could not get along with the profs, and taught herself everything she needed to know to complete her projects and start her own business. She has since designed products for both heavy industry and consumers.

**kjjjjshab** · Oct 01, 2009, 06:43 PM

Re: Mark Shuttleworth's keynote at LinuxCon

Maybe Mark needs to spend some time with a few centipedes...

http://www.gocomics.com/opus/2005/04/17/

**BigCityCat** · Nov 03, 2009, 08:12 PM

Re: Mark Shuttleworth's keynote at LinuxCon

People need to stop being overly sensitive and easily offended. I find that to be a bigger problem.

**GreyGeek** · Nov 03, 2009, 09:18 PM

Re: Mark Shuttleworth's keynote at LinuxCon

Originally posted by kjjjjshab

Maybe Mark needs to spend some time with a few centipedes...

http://www.gocomics.com/opus/2005/04/17/

mmmmm... when was the last time folks felt it necessary to imprison and torture those who didn't follow the latest group think?

The USSR, China, Saadam's Iraq, the Middle Ages.

**kjjjjshab** · Nov 03, 2009, 09:34 PM

Re: Mark Shuttleworth's keynote at LinuxCon

Originally posted by GreyGeek

Originally posted by kjjjjshab

Maybe Mark needs to spend some time with a few centipedes...

http://www.gocomics.com/opus/2005/04/17/

mmmmm... when was the last time folks felt it necessary to imprison and torture those who didn't follow the latest group think?

The USSR, China, Saadam's Iraq, the Middle Ages.

lol... I really just wanted to post that comic was all.... it is hanging up in our office since that exact thing happened during an administrator's speech once... committees had to be formed, mandatory reading of the reports, etc... you can imagine.

That said, as a white/male/american/30's it is my opinion to defer to the OP on a subject such as this... and if it did bother her enough to open a discussion, then perhaps it's a bigger deal than I would think...

**GreyGeek** · Nov 03, 2009, 09:46 PM

Re: Mark Shuttleworth's keynote at LinuxCon

It was a funny cartoon!

**kjjjjshab** · Nov 09, 2009, 09:47 PM

Re: Mark Shuttleworth's keynote at LinuxCon

(continued)

http://www.itwire.com/content/view/29190/1090/

"LinuxToday managing editor Carla Schroder has described Canonical founder Mark Shuttleworth as a "sexist twit" over some answers he gave at a Q and A held during an open week for the latest Ubuntu release."

**Ole Juul** · Nov 09, 2009, 11:47 PM

Re: Mark Shuttleworth's keynote at LinuxCon

Of course there are problems in our society, but I don't think it's Shuttleworth's fault. If he's a sexist twit, then I vastly prefer that to a jerk.

**kjjjjshab** · Nov 10, 2009, 08:05 AM

Re: Mark Shuttleworth's keynote at LinuxCon

Originally posted by Ole Juul

Of course there are problems in our society, but I don't think it's Shuttleworth's fault. If he's a sexist twit, then I vastly prefer that to a jerk.

That may certainly be, but there are others that I am sure feel this is just as relevant to their point of view as others feel about the Novell/opensuse & Microsoft and therefore important to at least recognize so everyone can make intelligent decisions about which distro they support.

**DeathKitten** · Nov 10, 2009, 12:48 PM

Re: Mark Shuttleworth's keynote at LinuxCon

Commenting on Shuttleworth's comments in the linked article... how the hezmanna does he expect to solve bug #1 without getting *everyone* who can help, not just those males who he isn't going out of his way to offend, to assist on working on it?

The LinuxCon comments, I could mostly excuse away, with the exception of the one I mentioned in my original posting, but dismissing his sexism in the name of pursuing Microsoft to take them done is just bull dren. Seriously? I don't know how well I can look the other way on his stupidity now. However, I am very happy with Kubuntu, so I'm going to have to find a way to express my displeasure with the jacka$$, other than boycotting his goods, as there are plenty of awesome people who are not sexist pigs involved in the project and I am very happy with the product of their hard work and dedication.

**Adrian** · Nov 10, 2009, 03:32 PM

Re: Mark Shuttleworth's keynote at LinuxCon

I'm tired of all this Political Correctness crap.

**Qqmike** · Nov 10, 2009, 04:22 PM

Re: Mark Shuttleworth's keynote at LinuxCon

(re Adrian's succinctness): Ha-Ha!!! Well put.
I'm NOT taking any sides on any of this issue (except I find women 100% equal in all ways to men etcetera and blah-blah). Just saying ha-ha! to 8 well-put words.