An update, at long last

[jglen490]

DoYouKubuntu : Sorry you're having so many weird adventures with your laptop(s). Your patience is amazing! I would have returned it long ago, taken the refund, and bought something better. I hope S76 will continue to do you right

[Snowhog]

I too, would not be as patient as she. I strongly believe that after sales support means more than good customer sales, but what she is experiencing is beyond the pale. Two problematic laptops in a row! Normal odds would suggest an extreme anomaly, but my cynical thinking says 'poor quality control' and/or 'poor quality assurance checks'. No one should experience what DoYouKubuntu is going through with a PC purchase. No one!

[Qqmike]

I admire your persistence, and your loyalty to 76, your patience. I think, though, I would side with the guys above -- take the money and run! Now I respect your decisions here DYK, and DIY is not for everyone, but, in comparison, I spent a few days (part time) researching up-to-date PC technology, for about $1050 placed orders at Amazon and Newegg for components, assembled them in a couple hours, pressed the start button ... and we are off and running with a functioning PC. There are options somewhere between your 76 experience and my quickie DIY choice. I am so sorry you are having to deal with this. Personally, I hate loose ends, pending unsettled deals, especially when it involves cash outlays.

[DoYouKubuntu]

I hear you, guys, really, believe me, I've had the same thoughts. I cannot tell you how flabbergasted I was when the laptop just DIED the other day. I sat here in disbelief, like, no, this can't be happening... but it was.

Ironically, the loaner (an identical Gazelle) that I've had for going-on-a-year has worked FLAWLESSLY this whole time. Looking back, I kind of wish I had accepted their invitation to put my preferred Linux (Kubuntu--it's running Pop) on it....but then I start thinking, you know, if I had done that....maybe it wouldn't have worked flawlessly all this time.

This is all new to me. As you can see from my sig, I started on *nix in 1985; my career was as a programmer and sysadmin (both--when you're the IT department at a small business, you do both!) on *nix, first at a furniture store chain then a major data processing company. I started using Linux in 1991, albeit not permanently--I was using Coherent back then (a UNIX clone, not free), and was very happy with it. Once I started hearing about this new, open-source, free *nix, of course my curiosity was piqued and I plunged in. I believe Red Hat was my first Linux--I still have the "Red Hat Linux Unleashed" book the CD came in--then dabbled with numerous other distros along the way. In 2005, I found Ubuntu; Hoary Hedgehog as I recall, (5.04), was my first installation; I immediately slapped KDE on it, and the rest is history. IN ALL THAT TIME, both professionally and personally, I've never seen anything like this!!

For the two weeks I used the new Gazelle, it was pure bliss. Beautiful display, fast as lightning, just couldn't have been happier. And then the unthinkable happens. *shrug*

To be honest, I don't know what I'm going to do going forward. The Gazelle is on its way to the shop now, but with the holidays there's no way I'll have it back for at least two weeks. I intend to keep the loaner indefinitely...well, not literally, but hopefully you get the idea. But I was already absolutely CERTAIN that everything was fine, and had the loaner ready to go. If not for UPS screwing up [again], it would've left last week! This time, I'll allow even MORE time to see if it's going to be okay. If there are any problems once the Gazelle is back in use, I probably would be an idiot NOT to throw in the towel. But that would not be, and I mean BY FAR NOT BE, the dumbest thing I've ever done, so we'll see!

[Snowhog]

I would be very interested in knowing what System76 finds wrong with your 'second' Gazelle. If they don't let you know (unlikely?), ASK!

Let's hope that 'third times the charm'. :fingers_crossed:

[DoYouKubuntu]

I would be very interested in knowing what System76 finds wrong with your 'second' Gazelle. If they don't let you know (unlikely?), ASK!

Let's hope that 'third times the charm'. :fingers_crossed:

Oh, no, they're VERY good about being up-front and explaining everything. So I have no doubt that I'll get the scoop on what caused the problem.

It was just so weird. Boom. Dead. Except that it still acted as a power source. Bizarre!!

[GreyGeek]

This does not bode well.
Two possible causes: bad laptops, or bad environment.

Bad environment:
A client called and said that the inventory app I wrote for them was malfunctioning. Random characters would accompany the clerk's data entry. The problem occurred if the workstation was plugged into the NetWare 1.0 network or not. As a former college prof who taught electronics I always carried a toolkit with me, which included an oscilloscope, believe it or not. The scope showed that the powerline voltage was moving up and down by 12v. I asked if they had any 12 volt equipment in the factory. They said they had just installed a Lincoln Welder which had 12v on its secondary output transformer. I went to the device and talked to the guy who installed it. He showed me how he did it and I looked at the input wave form to the welder. It, too, was oscillating. We went out to the power poll and observed that the center tap of the transformer was not grounded. When that was grounded the noise and the problem went away.

Is there anything in your location that could put noise on your power line? With today's nanotechnology line voltage noise could be enough to cause failures in poorly designed or insulated devices.

Bad laptop:
I remember in the early 2000's that a HD maker was having financial problems and in order to maintain/increase revenue they began shipping out as new 1 GB HD's which had been returned as bad. This soon caught up with them. We were on a contract purchase order and had received several of the bad HDs. They were all returned for a refund and we changed vendors. Your experience with System76 reminds me of that.

As much as my son's Gazelle ran so well, and is still running well, your experience has caused me to lose faith in that company. If your power line isn't showing any issues then in my opinion it is time to cut your losses, demand a full refund, and shop with another vendor.

[DoYouKubuntu]

Thanks for your input, GG.

To the best of my knowledge, there are no power-related issues involved--ironically, in about six hours I'll be WITHOUT power until tomorrow morning! SoCal Edison is doing a scheduled outage to replace/upgrade equipment. Anyway, no, I don't think electrical issues are at play here, but honestly, even if they were, I don't know how I'd be aware of that other than obvious things, like appliances not working, you know?

Also to the best of my knowledge, there are no quality issues here, either. Everything I've seen with my own eyes [inside the laptops] has been top-flight stuff; they even happen to use my preferred hard drive brand, Western Digital.

This is a really weird situation to be in. On the one hand, the customer service I've gotten from System76 has been amazing, outstanding, wonderful. But....on the other hand....well, here we are....with yet another bad laptop...

[Qqmike]

It doesn't sound good. However ... low-probability events in life DO certainly happen. Mathematically, anything can happen, even events with almost zero probability. Sometimes we perceive synchronicity in life events and attribute some "meaning" to them; when, in truth, it could very well be simply a mathematical fluke that a low-probability/near-zero probability event occurred.

OTOH, GG stories remind me of a time I had a PC built by a reputable local freelance builder (this was around 1998, before I starting building my own machines). The screen would freeze at random times. Bad RAM. Short story: He had put used RAM into my machine; had a micro-hairline crack.

[Snowhog]

They (who 'they' are is unknown!) say 'patience is a virtue', and on that, if I may be so bold, I'd say you are one of the most virtuous people I know!

Let's hope that you have just been extremely unlucky in having received two lemon laptops in a row. As I previously said, maybe the third time will be the charm.

[DoYouKubuntu]

I don't know, Snowhog! It took 60+ years to get a lemon ANYTHING--I mean I've never had a lemon, not a car, not a TV, not a...computer.... But TWO in a row? From the same company? OMFG....I just don't know.

You're right, by the way, that I am an extremely patient person. Which surprises people who know me in real life, because I'm *personally* extremely impatient. What I mean is, when *I* need to do something, I can't rest until it's done. The sooner the better. But when it comes to other people, I really make allowances. Within reason, of course.

Qqmike I'm right there with you on the mathematical possibility thing! Anything CAN happen, even if it only happens once in a blue moon, it *can* happen. So I'm not ready (at this moment) to write off S76 even in light of what looks like two lemons in a row.

[GreyGeek]

Oh, 60 years!
You're long overdue for a lemon, perhaps three.
Take a very quick peek at what's above your head ... if you see a small, dark cloud with tiny but silent lightening bolts then .....

[jglen490]

It'll probably turn out to be a failed power rail/circuit in the motherboard. Weird, nonetheless, on a new system.

[DoYouKubuntu]

It may sound quite bizarre, but I still feel pretty optimistic about this. We've all seen bad parts, parts that failed, new products that were defective, etc. One of my worst computer-related experiences happened with the server--the BRAND NEW, CUSTOM BUILT server--at the furniture store where I worked. SCSI drives were still relatively new, and I'd been convinced that we wanted SCSI drives in the new server... I've told this story before, I'm sure. Anyway, it failed. It failed MISERABLY, as in making loud, grinding and groaning noises that could be heard from outside my office. My phone rang off the hook at home as people called to let me know an awful sound was emanating from my office....and no one could access the computer system. I tried dialing in from my home office and couldn't get in either.

Once the bad hard drive was replaced, that server went on to perform solid as a rock. So we got a bad part. It happens. That's how I'm looking at this--until proven otherwise!