Trying to make my new Acer Aspire laptop dual boot with windows 8.1.

[Qqmike]

http://www.rodsbooks.com/refind/getting.html

• A USB flash drive image file—Although you can create your own rEFInd USB flash drive, you may find it easier to download this version and copy it to your USB drive with dd or some other low-level disk copying utility.

and the Tip on the right:

Tip: If you want to make your own bootable USB flash drive, download the binary zip file or CD-R image file, prepare a USB flash drive with a FAT32 partition, and then use the install.sh program's --usedefault option, and perhaps the --alldrivers option, as in bash install.sh --usedefault /dev/sdd1 --alldrivers to install to the first partition on /dev/sdd. This procedure should work even on a BIOS-booted computer.

which, I admit, is not immediately clear, but would probably unfold naturally as you start into doing this ... Another member here is using this to boot into his 15.10 as his booting got broken on a recent update. Or, just try using dd to copy it to a flash drive, see if that works, like we do here for a Kubuntu bootable flash drive:
https://www.kubuntuforums.net/showth...aller-using-dd

[Qqmike]

I'll also drop this for your consideration. When I build my PC recently,
https://www.kubuntuforums.net/showth...l=1#post368216
this is what I did to configure the UEFI settings to get started (brand new machine, nothing on it):

Configure UEFI (BIOS)

Turn on the PC, at the POST press the key (F2) to enter UEFI(-BIOS).
CSM (compatibility support module): set to Auto (default).
Disable Secure Boot: Change to “Other O/S”, which disables Secure Boot for the ASUS UEFI.
Disable Fast Boot.

[Qqmike]

And another thing some people resort to when they can't get their PC to see their boot loader:
You can set a default bootloader for your PC, at
-- Default bootloader is /EFI/BOOT/bootx64.efi, mounted as: /boot/efi/EFI/BOOT/bootx64.efi
So your UEFI firmware looks there and will boot whatever is there. Sometimes Windows has been placed there. You could put your GRUB there, renaming the main GRUB executable as bootx64.efi ... BUT, I've not done this, and with things so unclear here as to what's going on, I am VERY hesitant to try to do anything sexy like that, don't you agree? It should not be necessary!

Does Acer have any documentation on the in's-and-out's of its UEFI-"BIOS" firmware setup and menus? I'll bet it does/should, somewhere. ASUS does a nice job of that.

Future, general reference:
https://www.kubuntuforums.net/showth...l=1#post346604
https://www.kubuntuforums.net/showth...l=1#post373198
https://www.kubuntuforums.net/showth...l=1#post372221

[geezer]

Okay - I figured I had nothing to loose and I could boot Boot-Repair again if it did screw the boot.

I erased the MBR on laptop hdd. Booted live DVD into Kubuntu and issued:

dd if=/dev/zero of=/dev/sda bs=446 count=1

and rebooted - made no difference whatsoever. So I guess that answers the question that I am definitely booting UEFI, but what it takes to influence that Windows Boot Manager, I still have no idea.

What brand laptop are the people using that have been successful in installing Kubuntu with Windows 8.1 pre-installed?

I'm thinking that instead of wasting anymore time on this Acer computer, I'll take it back and look at another one. Asus? Toshiba? Lenovo?

I decided on the Acer since it seemed to give me the most bang for the buck, but now I'm not so sure.

[Qqmike]

What brand laptop are the people using that have been successful in installing Kubuntu with Windows 8.1 pre-installed?

I don't know. I'll bet people have used any and all of them, within reason -- the major brands. Acer should be OK, I would think. Some of this has to do with trying to dual boot Windows vs no Windows, but that should be possible.

Try to be sure you have checked all the detailed points listed in the posts above, though.

You could also google on Acer, Acer dual boot with Windows, Acer UEFI?, etc.

I have ASUS; I know someone else with ASUS -- no problems at all. ASUS does a good job with UEFI. UEFI is still so new that any maker might have some issues, though some buggyness.

Try to be sure you've covered all the points about. Surely, Acer must provide some UEFI ("BIOS") setup menus where its EFI boot manager displays its boot menu for you to choose from -- It is "supposed" to, I think!

When you install Kubuntu, it install GRUB to the ESP under /boot/efi/EFI/ubuntu, and it usually makes itself #1 in the BootOrder. Why is that not happening here? And so on. Very anomalous, imo.

We'll think on this. I'm sure others have read this--I know they have--but nothing is popping up yet. But do be sure you have exhausted the above tips. Frustrating, I know. This could be some little obscure, esoteric setting in the Acer UEFI setup menu somewhere that is stalling this. Who knows.

[Qqmike]

Like these two links, the first with Rod Smith answering Answer #1, the second also looks interesting.

Turning off Fast Startup in Windows seems important. And turning off Secure Boot might be an issue. There are some details to look at here:

http://askubuntu.com/questions/61688...-secure-boot-a

http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.p...9#post12800489

[Qqmike]

... continuing ... just a thought ... does Acer Aspire require you to set up a "BIOS" password before it reveals to you the more advanced UEFI firmware settings?

... some Acers can access UEFI firmware through the tile menu in Windows 8 ...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WfRlH4C4IaA

[Qqmike]

Some manuals are better than others. Since I built my PC, I know the motherboard and can use its manual, which is pretty good. The retail machines may be tweaked, though, and the raw motherboard manual may not be all you need. I would at least try to find the Acer Aspire Manual for the specific machine you have. There may be a tip-trick or two mentioned, maybe under an Advanced section.

http://us.acer.com/ac/en/US/content/drivers

[geezer]

... continuing ... just a thought ... does Acer Aspire require you to set up a "BIOS" password before it reveals to you the more advanced UEFI firmware settings?

... some Acers can access UEFI firmware through the tile menu in Windows 8 ...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WfRlH4C4IaA

No to the first. It does require a password to get to some other settings. I have set the password for the other settings and cleared the password a few times - it is cleared by entering the password you set and then leaving the new password blank.

I have been through the second option you mention, but that only brings up the BIOS screens that are available using the F2 key on boot.

I am still stuck totally on the Windows Boot manager screen on boot - NOTHING I have done or found changes it. Editing the BCD with bcdedit does nothing, EasyBCD does nothing, using the MSCong.exe program does nothing. Somehow the windows boot manager process has been set in permanently and cannot be changed.

[geezer]

Like these two links, the first with Rod Smith answering Answer #1, the second also looks interesting.

Turning off Fast Startup in Windows seems important. And turning off Secure Boot might be an issue. There are some details to look at here:

http://askubuntu.com/questions/61688...-secure-boot-a

http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.p...9#post12800489

Been through both of those. The first is the one that states flatly that 15.04 is no problem and installs simply as before. The second is a more involved process and I have been through that and use Boor-Repair and think that led to some of my problems. Been locked into the Windows Boot Manager since following that process.

[Qqmike]

So, the best option so far is, what, to boot the computer with a rEFInd live flash drive, see what it detects as boot options in the firmware, hope it offers ubuntu/Kubuntu, and boot into Kubuntu that way? Once in Kubuntu, at Konsole you could use efibootmgr to try to change the boot order, placing Kubuntu and rEFInd first and second. While in Kubuntu, trying again to re-install GRUB at the command line, hoping it will overtake but include Windows.

[geezer]

Well - finally!!!!!!!

Found a method to boot rEFInd. The Acer BIOS has an option for specifying a trusted boot file. I have steered away from that option since I didn't know the path/name of a trusted file. With all of the snooping I have done, I think I know of 1 or 2. specifically rEFInd.

So in an adventurous state I finally selected that option. Surprisingly it popped up a full screen with HDD0 listed. Didn't really know what that meant, but I was pretty sure it meant what I've been calling sda. Pressed Enter and got a second screen with 4, 5 or 6 (I didn't count them) options. Some I recognized: EFI, sys, run, proc and 1 or 2 more. The first, EFI, highlighted. Now I definitely recognized something. Pressed Enter.

That brought up a screen with All of the entries from the BCD - I recognized all of them. Used the arrow keys to highlight refind and pressed enter. That brought up another screen with the refind files. I used the arrow keys to highlight refindx64.efi and pressed Enter.

That that brought up a dialog box with the selected file filled in and <Yes> <No> options. Choose <Yes> and pressed Enter.

That brought up the rEFInd boot screen with a Windows 8.1 Logo and the Ubuntu Logo. Clicked the Ubuntu Logo. Unforunately that brought a screen with about a half screen of information, the gist of which was that the grubx64.efi was not trusted and that I could not proceed with secure boot. Choose the reboot option and opened BIOS again. Setup a password and turned off Secure Boot. Rebooted and got the rEFInd boot screen again and that now had the windows logo, and 3 Ubuntu logos - choose the one with the latest installed kernal, clicked it and booted into Kubuntu very nicely.

I think that using the BIOS option multiple times to specify a trusted boot file, once for each file, I could have specified more than one trusted boot file, but I left it at 1, refind. I like the boot screen.

So the ACer BIOS does list the bootable options, but in a very roundabout fashion. Not a list strictly, but a means of searching the disk to find them. IF you know what you are doing.

Now having secure boot turned off isn't real critical for me, but I would like to turn it back on. The rEFInd default of grubx64.efi won't do.

Any thoughts on how to accomplish that?

Just rebooted. Now only 2 Ubuntu Logos. Booted Windows just to insure that option still working - working.

[Qqmike]

Two thoughts:

SteveRiley--Linux and Windows expert--maintains there is no harm done in disabling secure boot; and not much benefit in not disabling it.

Another thought: When Secure Boot is enabled, as you noticed "grubx64.efi was not trusted." That's why we have that other mysterious executable: shimx64.efi. It is allowed, it gets around Secure Boot by simply passing control to the real McCoy grubx64.efi. Here, read all about it:
http://askubuntu.com/questions/34236...64-and-shimx64
That's why you will see grubx64.efi and shimx64.efi both always included together in the UEFI GRUB files for ubuntu (= Kubuntu) stored here (in your Kubuntu root directory): /boot/efi/EFI/ubuntu.

You have made real progress; basically you solved it. It would be nice NOT to have to click through so many screens, though, right? On my rEFInd, I see it in the UEFI firmware menu, I click it, I get a list of things it thinks it can boot for me, I choose from that list, click, and go. But you have basically whipped it.

You might consider what you can do. Can you get into Kubuntu and re-install GRUB from there? Will that place Kubuntu-GRUB as #1? Or, can you run efibootmgr, see the BootOrder, see rEFInd and/or ubuntu in it, and use man efibootmgr to change that BootOrder so ubuntu is #1 or rEFInd is #1?

It's all up to you!


EDIT, just to clarify my terminology above ...

Your ubuntu GRUB boot files are put in the ESP (usually sda1 or sda2). The ESP is mounted in your Kubuntu root directory at /boot/efi. The top-level directory of that is EFI/. In there is the directory ubuntu. The boot files for Kubuntu are in the ubuntu directory. Thus, you have:
/boot/efi/EFI/ubuntu/grubx64.efi
/boot/efi/EFI/ubuntu/shimx64.efi
and usually a
/boot/efi/EFI/ubuntu/grubcfg
and usually
/boot/efi/EFI/ubuntu/MokManager.efi.

Anything with the extension .efi is a UEFI executable (a program).

[Qqmike]

(I just added an EDIT to my post above.)

[Qqmike]

Another thought ...

You have rEFInd installed in Windows. How about booting into Kubuntu and installing it there? It might work differently (we hope better).

My how-to on that:
https://www.kubuntuforums.net/showth...l=1#post372221