Frequent linux-headers updates drives me crazy

[Joey Mendez]

I have to restart more than in Windows. In Windows 7 I only have to reboot on "Patch Tuesday". I installed Kubuntu 12.10 one month ago and it forced me to restart at least 3 times.

Why have to update the kernel so frequently? What happens if I don't do it? What's the proper solution? Should I uncheck these updates? Or should I ignore the Reboot notification icon in the tray?

[Snowhog]

This isn't unusual. Rebooting after a kernel 'update' is required in order for the changes to actually take effect.

[Joey Mendez]

So I have to reboot within 1 month period 2-3 times due to frequent kernel update? Are there any explanation why so urgent to update so often the kernel for the reason why can't delay until the end of the actual month?

[Arran]

Hi
You do NOT have to restart the machine, if this is too great a trouble for you. You can keep working until you close down the machine at evenings and then the restart is done quite naturally when starting in the morning. If you use your machine 24 hours, then it is anyway better to have three to four restarts in a month.

The frequent kernel upgrades are proof that at Linux people are working for us to give us the latest drivers for the latest hardware among other things. So, please do not complain but be rather thankful of that.

[vinnywright]

So I have to reboot within 1 month period 2-3 times due to frequent kernel update? Are there any explanation why so urgent to update so often the kernel for the reason why can't delay until the end of the actual month?

if it bothers you to do your updates as soon as thay are released you can of course do them at your leisure.
just ignore the update notification untill you are ready ,,,,,,or disable notifications all together and check for them manually once a month in muon.

I personally have disabled notifications and just run this in a terminal once a week

sudo apt-get update && sudo apt-get dist-upgrade

but you can have it however you like

VINNY

[PaulW2U]

I have to restart more than in Windows. In Windows 7 I only have to reboot on "Patch Tuesday". I installed Kubuntu 12.10 one month ago and it forced me to restart at least 3 times.

So are you saying that you want the developers to hold back the updates so that you are only told about them once a month?

I normally run the development version of Kubuntu and reboot several times each week. Sometimes I apply the update but don't reboot until I'm ready to do so. Personally I'd like to think that updates are made available as soon as they are ready and tested. Whether you download and apply the update and then reboot is up to you.

I really don't see a problem here.

[Joey Mendez]

Hi
The frequent kernel upgrades are proof that at Linux people are working for us to give us the latest drivers for the latest hardware among other things. So, please do not complain but be rather thankful of that.

This is why I asked how important the immediately upgrade. Of course, thanks for the work.
I don't want to disable and set less frequent the check, because I like to upgrade every component, included the softwares what no needed to restart.
The best solution would be if I able to delay only the "needs restart" updates. But it doesn't even indicates which update ask restart and which doesn't.

BTW I always heard from everywhere that the Linux is better in this respect too, because the users have to restart Windows for every update in contrast the Linux able to update everything without restart except the kernel. Now I faced with that situation that in Linux the kernel updated more frequently than whatever in Windows. Again, I don't complaining about the community's work, I was expecting just that there will be enough one reboot per month or even less.

Of course there are automount, session restore so this is not a big deal. I mean, there are bigger problems, like unremovable akonadi, disabled akonadi/nepomuk-releated garbage in the .xsession-errors file, etc.

[oshunluvr]

Also a big difference between windows and linux on this topic:

Even the smallest change to a Windows system requires a reboot. Therefore, every update results in a reboot. Therefore a once-monthly reboot cycle has been deemed more user friendly. Microsoft has never cared much about security in the public user realm so user happiness is valued over an update that might plug a dangerous exploit.

In my Linux experience, only a kernel update or certain external driver changes (like nvidia, virtualbox, etc.) require a reboot. Therefore, a continual update cycle is deemed not overly intrusive. This is also why, when there is an update that requires a reboot, you are notified about it separately (at least with muon) and it is not automatically selected for you by the update manager.

To be fair, this difference is also a by-product of a single-source update supplier vs. a slew of developers working on different parts of the overall OS.

[weha]

Ksplice
Will update kernels without reboot. I have never used it, but if you are interested ..

http://www.dedoimedo.com/computers/ksplice.html

[Joey Mendez]

B.t.w. Akonadi does no longer need disabling on my laptop, as of recent it does it's job nicely.

Why should I run +5-6-7 processes if I don't use any Akonadi-releated thing? I don't use any of KDE PIM, I disabled Nepomuk, I only use the Time and Date plasma widget but on the one hand I don't understand why can't function the calendar without Akonadi (I mean: normally it should fetching only a xml file periodically), on the other hand I disabled the calendar part.

So I no need Akonadi anymore.

BTW this is the other what I've heard about Linux: Completely customizable, the users even able to take to pieces the whole system. And what I've get in the reality? Some things, like Akonadi, Nepomuk, Soprano are hardcored in the same way in the system like IE, Windows Explorer, Windows Mail, etc. in Windows...

[kubicle]

Why should I run +5-6-7 processes if I don't use any Akonadi-releated thing?

You don't. Akonadi does not start if there is nothing using it...even if you don't use kdepim applications, there are plasma widgets and krunner runners that call akonadi (causing it to start)...remove the widgets (the calendar events can be disabled in the clock widget without removing it) and disable the krunner modules that use akonadi and akonadi won't start.

BTW this is the other what I've heard about Linux: Completely customizable, the users even able to take to pieces the whole system. And what I've get in the reality? Some things, like Akonadi, Nepomuk, Soprano are hardcored in the same way in the system like IE, Windows Explorer, Windows Mail, etc. in Windows...

That's like saying kdelibs is hard-coded to linux (it isn't)...software comes with dependencies, and they are there for a reason. Without them, it would be very easy for users to remove essential functionality by mistake or ignorance. It's impossible to tailor packaging to meet the exact needs of every single user.

[Joey Mendez]

That's like saying kdelibs is hard-coded to linux (it isn't)...software comes with dependencies, and they are there for a reason. Without them, it would be very easy for users to remove essential functionality by mistake or ignorance.

So explain this: http://www.kubuntuforums.net/showthr...l=1#post322658

Why depends those softwares from Akonadi and Nepomuk? I list only a few very conspicious: adobe-flash-properties-kde, ark, bluedevil, dolphin, gstreamer, gwenview, kdiff3, etc. Why? What to do Akonadi and Nepomuk with these packages?
And if I disable Nepomuk why logs garbage in the .xsession-errors file, like

QInotifyFileSystemWatcherEngine::addPaths inotify_add_watch failed: Permission denied
QFileSystemWatcher failed to add paths: /root
QInotifyFileSystemWatcherEngine::addPaths inotify_add_watch failed: Permission denied
QFileSystemWatcher failed to add paths: /lost+found
dolphin(PID)/kio (KDirWatch) KDirWatchPrivate::removeEntry doesn't know "/dev"
dolphin(PID) KItemListView::slotItemsRemoved Invalid item range (index: -1 , count: 0 )

"/usr/bin/dolphin(PID)" Soprano "Could not connect to server at /tmp/ksocket-user/nepomuk-socket (No such file or directory)"
"/usr/bin/dolphin(PID)" Soprano "Could not connect to server at /tmp/ksocket-user/nepomuk-socket (No such file or directory)"
"/usr/bin/dolphin(PID)" Soprano "Unsupported operation (2)": "Invalid model"
"/usr/bin/dolphin(PID)" Soprano "Unsupported operation (2)": "Invalid model"
"/usr/bin/dolphin(PID)" Soprano "Invalid iterator."

If I enable again I "only" get these:

[/usr/bin/nepomukservicestub] void Soprano::Server::ServerCore::serverConnectionFinis hed()
virtual Soprano::Server::ServerConnection::~ServerConnecti on() Removing connection
void Soprano::Server::ServerCore::serverConnectionFinis hed() Connection removed. Current count: 8
[/usr/bin/nepomukservicestub] virtual void Soprano::Server::LocalServer::incomingConnection(q uintptr)
[/usr/bin/nepomukservicestub] void Soprano::Server::ServerCorePrivate::addConnection( Soprano::Server::ServerConnection*) New connection. New count: 9
[/usr/bin/nepomukservicestub] Soprano::ODBC::Connection::Connection() Soprano::Server::ServerConnection

[kubicle]

So explain this: http://www.kubuntuforums.net/showthr...l=1#post322658

I thought I just did :P

Why depends those softwares from Akonadi and Nepomuk? I list only a few very conspicious: adobe-flash-properties-kde, ark, bluedevil, dolphin, gstreamer, gwenview, kdiff3, etc. Why? What to do Akonadi and Nepomuk with these packages?

You have to separate package dependencies from runtime dependencies...not all package recursive depends are runtime dependencies...for example "akonadi-server" has fairly light reverse depends on the first level (basically just kdepim-runtime and plasma-widgets-workspace and a few other akonadi-related packages depend on akonadi-server)...but there are other packages that depend on "kdepim-runtime" and "plasma-widgets-workspace" and still other packages that depend on those (this doesn't mean all these recursive depends need or use akonadi-server, which would be a runtime dependency).

Package dependencies are needed to keep the packaging system sane, even if they don't exactly match the runtime dependencies (some package dependencies are actual runtime dependencies, but not all of them)...if you would build your system from scratch you'd only have to worry about runtime dependencies (and build dependencies when building), and only build the things you need (of course you'd still have to keep an eye for actual runtime dependencies...you couldn't run kmail without akonadi, but you could certainly build and run ark without it, for example.

And if I disable Nepomuk why logs garbage in the .xsession-errors file, like

That "garbage" looks like normal debug output to me. Dolphin has a soft dependency on nepomuk. It uses nepomuk enhanced search functions if nepomuk is available, but will work without it if nepomuk is disabled (the search enhancements disabled, of course). The debug output is likely the result of dolphin trying to use nepomuk and sending debug output because nepomuk is disabled. You can tune down debug-errors a bit by checking the debug settings with "kdebugdialog".

[Joey Mendez]

You can tune down debug-errors a bit by checking the debug settings with "kdebugdialog".

I can't because there are no Soprano-releated entry in the kdebugdialog.

[kubicle]

I can't because there are no Soprano-releated entry in the kdebugdialog.

Soprano, being qt-only (no kde libraries), likely uses qdebug instead of kdebug (so the output can't be controlled with kdebugdialog).

With qdebug, one should be able to disable debug output with build flags (I was under the impression that kubuntu disables debug with release versions, but I could be wrong about that). It's also possible that a bug in soprano causes it to ignore disabled debug.

Unfortunately it's hard for me to troubleshoot this, as soprano isn't chatty on my end ('grep -i soprano .xsession-errors' outputs nothing). I use Akonadi, but have Nepomuk disabled...and running raring.

Of course you could try disabling all debug output in kdebugdialog (suppressing dolphin's output might affect the soprano messages, worth a shot anyway). You can easily enable debug again if you need it.