Will Rekonq be Updated for the LTS?

[vw72]

My parents laptops running Kubuntu 11.04 and my old install of 11.10 still receive updates for Firefox with full KDE integration. It is a shame the LTS release breaks this tradition.

People who aren't linux enthusiasts want a browser that just works and is safe/stable with regular updates to improve/maintain the safety/stability/relevance to the web. Putting out a half baked browser into a LTS release that is suppose to be recommended to goverment, schools, and family with no real optional browsers that have integration is a move that is almost funny. At least a person running windows can install the latest Firefox and it works natively with their system and will continue working for the next decade. Try telling the end user they can't on their "recommended" linux install that is buntu "friendly."

I am all for KDE/Qt aps becoming successful but the reality is this KDE distribution needs Open/Libre Office and Firefox to fulfill the common users needs. When the KDE community has something that actually replaces it then by all means. Till then this is a broken release to the average user who expects an open button that works and brings up the correct program to use the file.

The real issue is whether or not it is KDE's or Kubuntu's responsibility to patch Mozilla's Firefox to work with KDE or is it Mozilla's responsibility. To date, Mozilla has never ensured that Firefox worked under KDE and various other developers have hacked it to make it work seamlessly. Yes, it is an important browser, but it takes a lot of effort to patch it to work with KDE and now that Firefox is on a quick release schedule, it is even more difficult to keep up.

Kubuntu could freeze Firefox at the last version that worked with the kde-integration package, but then everybody would be complaining that it was an old version. Instead, they are shipping Firefox the way that Mozilla has designed Firefox to work. Mozilla's indifference to KDE is probably one of the reasons more and more people are using alternatives like chromium.

The decision to go with rekonq is not trying to force a KDE/QT app down anybody's throat, instead it is the default KDE browser and Kubuntu ships it that way. I will say that since Steve pointed out the latest git version was available, I installed it and it is very, very stable, on my system. It doesn't have all the plugins I use, but it is definitely a big step in the right direction.

In the end, though, it seems that Mozilla should be the one people are venting at for not supporting KDE, not Kubuntu or any other KDE based distribution. The distributions can only work with what they are given and in the case of Firefox, they haven't been given much to work with (in terms of integration).

[SteveRiley]

In the end, though, it seems that Mozilla should be the one people are venting at for not supporting KDE, not Kubuntu or any other KDE based distribution.

Hear, hear.

But:

Mozilla's indifference to KDE is probably one of the reasons more and more people are using alternatives like chromium.

Chrom(e)ium is equally indifferent to KDE. Where is the equivalent hue and cry?

[vw72]

Hear, hear.

But:

Chrom(e)ium is equally indifferent to KDE. Where is the equivalent hue and cry?

Chrom(e)ium is equally indifferent to everyone!

Personally, I've been using Opera on Kubuntu 12.04 and it is working extremely well. In a different post you mentioned the rekonq-git and I installed that on one of my test machines and with the exception of one site, it has worked splendidly. I am seriously considering going back to it as may standard browser. The one thing rekonq really needs are a few more plugins/extensions.

[SteveRiley]

Chrom(e)ium is equally indifferent to everyone!

I stand corrected

The one thing rekonq really needs are a few more plugins/extensions.

This fascination with plug-ins and extensions is curious. Even when I used Firefox and Chromium regularly, I never found myself searching for add-ons. What are some of the popular ones? I ask because I wonder whether there might be alternate ways to accomplish the same thing these add-ons do.

[jlittle]

Can't live without:

• Adblock plus - (I've tried the hosts file approach, didn't work well)
• Color toggle - lets me impose my background colour on pages, though the invert desktop effect competes
• It's All Text! - invokes my editor, vim, on text fields (one can use cut and paste, I suppose)
• Tab Mix plus - lots of options for tabs
• Stylish - impose my themes on the web,

Firefox has become slow and clunky, but it lets me control it, with the help of a huge user community.

[wrender]

The venting is at the situation that has no available solution to a problem which is is a primary usability issue to an end user.

Use Rekonq which may or may not be updated to be a solid program. If you want a solid version use a custom non safe repo.

Use Firefox which has an actual shortcut to install the browser built into the interface by default but has zero integration(what is the point then?).

Use Chromium which almost works but doesn't have an option to directly open downloads (Try explaining this to average joe why he can't)

Use Opera which does have integration but is a closed source program and takes some playing with to make cozy for the common person that uses Firefox on windows/mac at home/work. Also the odd random sites seem to display "differently"


All I am pointing out is that for a "recommended" LTS release this primary usability issue seems like there is no formal addressing. Instead it is random Kubuntu users realizing and scrambling to figure it out for themselves. Yes cooperation probably needs to happen within the developers of the browsers communities. But where does that communication best originate? Perhaps an official inquiry from people that make up the contributing Kubuntu community is better suited than a random user like myself post release?

At the end of the day it doesn't matter. But to the average end user neither will Kubuntu if they have to finagle to have a proper browser. If the goal is to create a friendly easy to use distribution then that is the "real issue." I would rather reflect this in the forum/community towards something positive. If there is a petition to sign I'd be more than happy. If there is a random browser forum thread where kubuntu users can +1 a vote/comment. Let me know. But till then If one can't openly discuss problems dealing kubuntu here what is the point?

[sartic]

I think if someone wants fast and stable web browser which has kde integration (file dialogs etc), he has to use chromium/chrome.

1) Firefox - slow, choppy scrolling, no kde integration.
2) Rekonq - crashy, not supporting all sites, not enough man power (developers) to make full blown web browser and to maintain it
3) Opera - hmm it just suck for me under linux
4) Chrome - stable, fast, smooth (not choppy) scrolling, kde integration.

These are mine experiences. So for me Chrome is the best (only?) choice for "full experience" under KDE.
Btw I am using Chrome instead of Chromium because Chrome has more frequent updates, has built in (less buggy) flash and built in PDF reader.

Cheers

Firefox is great but lacks integration (i hope this will be solved soon)
Opera is sweat, 2nd choice for me.
I tried Google Chrome (from site). Do not like this browser, but I tried.... it even doesn't start right in Kubuntu LTS 64bit

[vw72]

I stand corrected


This fascination with plug-ins and extensions is curious. Even when I used Firefox and Chromium regularly, I never found myself searching for add-ons. What are some of the popular ones? I ask because I wonder whether there might be alternate ways to accomplish the same thing these add-ons do.

Adblock is probably the most popular, but it is already built in to rekonq. Any of the ones that allow you to save you-tube videos are quite popular also.

[vw72]

The venting is at the situation that has no available solution to a problem which is is a primary usability issue to an end user.

Use Rekonq which may or may not be updated to be a solid program. If you want a solid version use a custom non safe repo.

Use Firefox which has an actual shortcut to install the browser built into the interface by default but has zero integration(what is the point then?).

Use Chromium which almost works but doesn't have an option to directly open downloads (Try explaining this to average joe why he can't)

Use Opera which does have integration but is a closed source program and takes some playing with to make cozy for the common person that uses Firefox on windows/mac at home/work. Also the odd random sites seem to display "differently"


All I am pointing out is that for a "recommended" LTS release this primary usability issue seems like there is no formal addressing. Instead it is random Kubuntu users realizing and scrambling to figure it out for themselves. Yes cooperation probably needs to happen within the developers of the browsers communities. But where does that communication best originate? Perhaps an official inquiry from people that make up the contributing Kubuntu community is better suited than a random user like myself post release?

At the end of the day it doesn't matter. But to the average end user neither will Kubuntu if they have to finagle to have a proper browser. If the goal is to create a friendly easy to use distribution then that is the "real issue." I would rather reflect this in the forum/community towards something positive. If there is a petition to sign I'd be more than happy. If there is a random browser forum thread where kubuntu users can +1 a vote/comment. Let me know. But till then If one can't openly discuss problems dealing kubuntu here what is the point?

I definitely empathize with you on your frustration, but it doesn't change the fact that it is Firefox not supporting KDE that is the issue. It makes sense from their point since the two largest distros Ubuntu and Redhat/Fedora are Gnome based. But at the same time, from a programming perspective, they could have built in the hooks so it would have worked with anything.

As for explaining this to the average Joe, it is quite simple: Firefox/Chromium/Chrome choose not to support KDE and if you want to use one of those browsers, you are going to manually have to make some configuration changes. Yes, it sucks, but unless those browsers want to support all users, it won't change.

Opera is a good alternative, except most distros won't ship it as it is closed source. The company, though, is very open source friendly and works with the open source community to ensure compatibility, etc. As for sites that don't display correctly, usually it is because they are coded for a specific browser out of Redmond, WA or with tools for that browser. Opera is always touted as the most standard compliant browser available, but if web designers don't follow the actual standards, then pages might not display correctly.

Finally, there is rekonq. The version shipped with 12.04 is not the latest. It will be updated, without having to enable a custom non safe repo. It will require the official backports repo to be enabled. If you do enable the so called non-safe "goodies" repo, it uses a different package name for rekonq to avoid conflicts. The current release version is 0.9.2. The current git version is 0.9.57. I have not used 0.9.2, but I am using 0.9.57 and it is rock solid.

At the end of the day, it really does matter. But unless we focus on what the real problem is, we can't solve the real problem. The real problem is two-fold. First rekonq is quite ready for prime-time, close but not quite there yet. The second is that the alternative browsers from the Windows world, while supporting Gnome, do not really support KDE. To solve the problem, KDE developers can either expend limited developer resources making rekonq ready for prime-time or expend those resources making the other browsers work with KDE. A third option, outside of KDE development, would be for KDE users to lobby those other browsers to support KDE as that is where the integration should really come from (for instance Microsoft doesn't integrate Firefox into Windows, nor do the Gnome developers integrate it into Gnome).

But all of that said, it still is frustrating, whether one uses Kubuntu or any number of KDE distros.

[SteveRiley]

Any of the ones that allow you to save you-tube videos are quite popular also.

Check out Minitube and something called youtube-dl. They aren't browser plugins, but they accomplish the same thing. The latter works at the command line, and sucks down the real video file buried within the FLV.

[SteveRiley]

It will be updated, without having to enable a custom non safe repo. It will require the official backports repo to be enabled. If you do enable the so called non-safe "goodies" repo, it uses a different package name for rekonq to avoid conflicts.

Sumski, the maintainer of that PPA, is a long-time member of the KDE community. The packages are pulled directly from the KDE Git and compiled. I have no reason to imagine that these are unsafe.

[vw72]

Sumski, the maintainer of that PPA, is a long-time member of the KDE community. The packages are pulled directly from the KDE Git and compiled. I have no reason to imagine that these are unsafe.

I didn't mean to imply that the ppa is unsafe. I was only using the original poster's language. I was only disappointed that I hadn't hear about the ppa before stumbling upon it in your post. Maybe KFN should have a place to post useful ppas.

On a side note, I am really upset with you, because after moving everything I do over to Opera, then you tell me about the rekonq ppa and now I'm moving everything again! Just kidding of course (about being upset), but I must say it is too bad the rekonq-git version couldn't have been ready in time for 12.04. It just simply works!

[SteveRiley]

On a side note, I am really upset with you, because after moving everything I do over to Opera, then you tell me about the rekonq ppa and now I'm moving everything again! Just kidding of course (about being upset),

Heh

but I must say it is too bad the rekonq-git version couldn't have been ready in time for 12.04. It just simply works!

Yeah, I'm very happy with it. It does mystify me, though, how variable it can be. For instance, I have no problems viewing Flash videos. Yet others, who've set it up exactly the same way, can't see anything other than an empty black box.

[vw72]

Heh


Yeah, I'm very happy with it. It does mystify me, though, how variable it can be. For instance, I have no problems viewing Flash videos. Yet others, who've set it up exactly the same way, can't see anything other than an empty black box.

I wonder if the flash problem has to do with where their flash came from (ie. kubuntu-extras, manually installed, medibuntu, or some other ppa). My rekonq-git also plays flash just wonderfully, also.

[mdye]

Hey I don't know if you guys have tried Firefox or Chrome/ium on a Gnome system, but, the truth is, neither Google nor Mozilla care much about *any* toolkit, and that includes GTK. Neither of them integrate very well with GTK in general, nor have either of them updated to GTK3. Both, to varying degrees, look out of place in a GTK2 environment (Firefox has odd quirks that pop up from time to time and Chrome refuses to use GTK scrollbars and looks like something left over from 2005.) In my experience, I have yet to encounter a good web browser that integrates properly with Linux - either it's good and sticks out (Firefox, Chrome/ium) or it looks good in the particular environment - uses the toolkit, etc. (Epiphany, Midori, Rekonq, Konqueror) but is, to varying degrees, terrible.

And while on the topic - and excuse me if I'm posting in the wrong thread - has anyone had any issues with Rekonq and cookies? Specifically with Facebook, of all things. It seems that every time I click on a link in FB it logs me out. The issue is lessoned somewhat if I set my browser identification to the latest Firefox version, but it still does it randomly and is incredibly annoying. I'm giving KDE a go again after months and months of exile in Windows land (shudder) - I'm loving KDE in general (every release has improved the user experience). I'm a bit annoyed that Rekonq is suddenly having problems with this and this bug went to print. Just to make sure, I went back to the live image on my USB and it had the same problem. What gives?? Anyone know anything? :-)