Kubuntu "Hanging" while working.

[bai.ganga]

I have an old desktop with a P4 processor, 1 GB RAM and 40 GB HDD. For the past eight years since I purchased it, I have been using it as a dual-boot system with Linux and Windows-XP. I am comfortable using both these OS but don't have any knowledge about "how to" except for browsing the internet and working on some documents like word, powerpoint, excel, pdf etc. as well as watching some movies occasionally. I migrated from Redhat to Kubuntu some time in the year 2007 and have been always upgrading to the latest version of Kubuntu, currently on version 11.10 since end of October. Every time during the upgrade, I 'format' the Kubuntu portion of the hard-disk and load the new version while the 'windows' portion has remained 'as it is' for past eight years since this desktop was purchased.

I am facing a peculiar problem so often now-a-days. At least about ten times in the last couple of months, I have noticed that while working with Kubuntu 11.10, the picture [display] freezes and the cursor cannot be moved by the mouse. The keyboard too becomes non-functional. One thing I noticed is that almost always, [although I am not sure that this is the only situation] it happens while I am on the internet and scrolling down using the 'wheel' on the mouse towards the bottom of the page being displayed. After the display freezes, I have also kept the computer 'undisturbed' upto 10 minutes and noticed that nothing happens in the situation. Even ctrl+alt+del on the keyboard or the "off button" on the CPU does not function in this situation and the red LED on the CPU which keeps flickering always when the CPU is ON, remains OFF giving an impression that it is actually OFF -- but, the fan inside the CPU is running as can be confirmed by the humming sound.

The only way to finally recover from the situation is to either push the "restart" button on the CPU or "switch off" power supply and start up again. I know both are bad for the computer but I don't seem to have a choice! The problem never occurred while working on Win-XP platform. I can probably say that on an average, I work with windows for about four hours per day and with Kubuntu for three hours per day.

Can anyone help please?

[Snowhog]

Re: Kubuntu "Hanging" while working.

Often, what appears as a locked system, really isn't totally locked. Next time it happens, use the 'magic key sequence' to regain control and do a controlled shutdown/reboot.

Hold and press together: Alt+PrtSc and while both are still pressed, press and release the following keys: r s e i u b

[dibl]

Re: Kubuntu "Hanging" while working.

Snowhog's suggested solution will work if the problem is a hung video display, which is likely. However, if it does not work, then the problem is deeper, and is hardware related.

I have an old desktop with a P4 processor, 1 GB RAM and 40 GB HDD. For the past eight years since I purchased it, I have been using it as a dual-boot system with Linux and Windows-XP.

Eight years is a long life for a desktop computer -- it has given you good service. But it is unlikely to continue working well for much longer, without major failures like the PSU and CPU fan, which are partly mechanical. Also, you should run an overnight memory test, as it could be experiencing intermittent failure. The bottom line -- you need to get serious about a new computer.

I migrated from Redhat to Kubuntu some time in the year 2007 and have been always upgrading to the latest version of Kubuntu, currently on version 11.10 since end of October.
...
The problem never occurred while working on Win-XP platform.

So, you have Win XP, which is an OS that was current at the time your hardware was designed, and you have Kubuntu 11.10, which is designed for modern (~2010) hardware. At some point, it is reasonable to expect "new software on old hardware" problems to emerge in this situation. You would have trouble with Windows 7, too!

One thing I noticed is that almost always, [although I am not sure that this is the only situation] it happens while I am on the internet and scrolling down using the 'wheel' on the mouse towards the bottom of the page being displayed.

This sounds like a video issue -- probably you have an ancient Intel 815 or 915 GPU, which is struggling under the newest xserver-xorg display system. If that is the only problem, then Snowhog's procedure will restart the system. But you'll still be on borrowed time with that old hardware.

[bai.ganga]

Re: Kubuntu "Hanging" while working.

Thank you both for taking your valuable time to reply to my post. I will try the suggested Alt+Prtsc and R-S-E-I-U-B in sequence next time that happens. Just now, I am on Win-XP.

But then, I have some serious doubts about some portions of the replies as follows:

Eight years is a long life for a desktop computer -- it has given you good service. But it is unlikely to continue working well for much longer, without major failures like the PSU and CPU fan, which are partly mechanical. Also, you should run an overnight memory test, as it could be experiencing intermittent failure. The bottom line -- you need to get serious about a new computer.

I do agree that the piece is too old and I am continuing to use this one 'till the time it totally gives up'. And since the last year, data storage is in a separate hard disk with bare-minimum things on the main computer itself. Out of the 40 GB hard disk, more than 25 GB is free and there is almost no data on it. So, no loss even when it packs up without warning!

And, what is this overnight memory test you mentioned? Can you please tell me how to do it and what to expect? I am using a program called "RAM saver Pro" while on windows and it continuously indicates the RAM in MB free at any given time. Most often, it shows about 400-500 MB free while on the internet and with internet off, when I am working on any document or watching movie, it shows almost 700+ MB free. It also has a GUI which when opened up, shows the usage of RAM by various other programs and processes running in the background.

At some point, it is reasonable to expect "new software on old hardware" problems to emerge in this situation. You would have trouble with Windows 7, too!

I tried to install win-7 once about two years ago (?) and it said can't do -- of course then the RAM available was only 256 MB. This piece of RAM went bad and I had replaced it with 1 GB [brand new piece] in Jan 11. By the way, when I bought this computer, it was nearly the "latest" with Hard disk and RAM size second highest available in the market!

But then, I had read a post somewhere in this forum long ago [2 or 3 years ?] saying that Kubuntu is ideally suited to work on old hardware with very less hard disk space and RAM. If I remember correctly, it can work with just 64 MB RAM and about 5 GB of hard disk space.

Please don't feel offended. I raised the above queries just so that I can understand the whole thing connected with this better. Thank you in advance.

[dibl]

Re: Kubuntu "Hanging" while working.

And, what is this overnight memory test you mentioned? Can you please tell me how to do it and what to expect?

Either on your boot menu, or with a Live CD, you will find an entry "Memtest 86" (or "Memory Test") or something like that. This is a routine that simply writes and reads the memory cells in your memory modules. If you let it run overnight, it will detect if there is an intermittent failure on the modules. That's what you need to find out, to make sure the problem is only a video issue.

I did not mean to insult your computer. I'm sure it was a marvelous piece of equipment when it was new. But 8 years is an eternity in technology, and it is quickly becoming obsolete to the point where new Linux drivers and the X server system are not going to try to keep it running correctly.

[bai.ganga]

Re: Kubuntu "Hanging" while working.


[/quote] Either on your boot menu, or with a Live CD, you will find an entry "Memtest 86" (or "Memory Test") or something like that. This is a routine that simply writes and reads the memory cells in your memory modules. If you let it run overnight, it will detect if there is an intermittent failure on the modules. That's what you need to find out, to make sure the problem is only a video issue. [/quote]

After reading the above portion, my confusion has increased! I think I see this 'memtest' as one of the four or five choices during start up every time [is it part of that thing called GRUB ?]. If it is not, no problem -- I have the Kubuntu CD prepared about two months ago from which I had loaded this update and I can use that CD. Exactly what do I do? Do I just select that memtest and leave the computer on for the night? What is it expected to show? How long do I wait to get the results? Please explain the exact steps to be followed. Once again, Thank you very much in advance!

[/quote] I did not mean to insult your computer. I'm sure it was a marvelous piece of equipment when it was new. But 8 years is an eternity in technology, and it is quickly becoming obsolete to the point where new Linux drivers and the X server system are not going to try to keep it running correctly. [/quote]

Yes . . . I am fully aware that the computer is old and I have not at all felt bad about your comments that you yourself have termed as an "insult"! For the time being, it is satisfying my requirements and I am very sure that I don't want to have two pieces at home even if one of them is a laptop. And, when this one finally 'packs up' I will have absolutely no hesitation to take it to its grave and then get a new piece. I will have chances of getting the latest model if the 'death' of this computer gets delayed.

[de_koraco]

Re: Kubuntu "Hanging" while working.

But then, I had read a post somewhere in this forum long ago [2 or 3 years ?] saying that Kubuntu is ideally suited to work on old hardware with very less hard disk space and RAM. If I remember correctly, it can work with just 64 MB RAM and about 5 GB of hard disk space.

You read wrong. Linux in general is suited for running on old hardware, since you don't have to use resource heavy desktops like KDE or Gnome. More minimalist desktop environments like XFCE or LXDE, as well as standalone window managers like Openbox, Fluxbox, JWM, Xmonad, Ratpoison, PekWM and a bazillion others, can run on ludicrously small amounts of RAM.

[bai.ganga]

Re: Kubuntu "Hanging" while working.

I really liked the following portion: "The only way Kubuntu could be more user friendly would be if it came with a virtual copy of Snowhog and dibl" and, I am totally in agreement with that! They have posted maximum replies to all problems posted here! 8)

[dibl]

Re: Kubuntu "Hanging" while working.

Do I just select that memtest and leave the computer on for the night? What is it expected to show?

Yes.

When you check your computer the next day, it will show whether any memory errors occurred.

[bai.ganga]

Re: Kubuntu "Hanging" while working.

Thanks . . . . I did the test and it took about 90 minutes or so to complete. After that, it gave a message saying something like "memtest passed", press "ESC" to reboot. Everything seems to be OK there!

[bai.ganga]

Re: Kubuntu "Hanging" while working.

good to hear that.

[bai.ganga]

Re: Kubuntu "Hanging" while working.

Finally . . . I think this computer has started really misbehaving and I must write the story about the symptoms as well as the cure that I had done for the benefit of all other users in this forum.

For a fortnight or so, when I switch ON the computer, a message used to come saying "No signal. Check data cable" and the display on the monitor used to just go OFF. And, the CPU is running as per the light & sound indications on it but no indications on the monitor --- it is as if the computer has gone off to 'sleep' and keyboard or mouse does not 'wake it up. If I restart using the button on the CPU, I can see the CPU going through the process of restart but, no indications on the monitor. And if I try to switch off using the on/off push-button on the CPU, it just won't switch off. If I switch off the power supply and again start up, there was a chance of the BIOS loading, sometimes after about four or five such attempts. During this process, the message said that something seems to have gone wrong and press F2 to enter BIOS utility and make changes or the system will load default BIOS. Once this message appears, it is success . . . . GRUB comes up and I can load either WindowsXP of Kubuntu as chosen by me.

About four days ago, once during start up of windows, the message said it wanted to do a disk check. I let the system go through with that disk check. First time in my life I saw some messages popping up during windows disk check saying something is truncated in some sector and something is being deleted in another sector and so on. And . . . . . .after the restart, the windows first screen came on but before the desktop display, some dark blue screen displayed just for a second and the system went for a restart without displaying the desktop back ground. This process is repeating whenever I try to go into windows. Maybe, the only thing that has happened is that an important program file has been accidentally deleted by the 'disk check' utility of windowsXP. But, at the moment, I am not willing to 're-install' windows just because I also fear that there could be a hardware problem.

A good thing is that I can login into the computer through Kubuntu now without any problem. And, I am not bothered about losing whatever data that is there on this hard disk. After this 'disk check' incident, the 'check data cable' message never appeared during at least 20 starts that I had performed. Every time, I have a very clean start and switch off using Kubuntu. 8) The only problem is that my operations are a bit restricted because I am not so confident with libre office3 as I am with MS office 2007. I need to experiment a bit with that and learn how to use all its features.

By the way, it is also worth mentioning about something similar had happened with a laptop that I own about 18-20 months ago. I had it configured for dual boot with Win-7 and Kubuntu. That piece had just finished its one year warranty period when it started giving a lot of problems of overheating --- extremely hot air coming out of the small exhaust system on its back side. Then, the display used to 'freeze' and there was no way to switch off with its keyboard, mouse and on/off switch was non-effective. I even tried keeping it idle for an hour or so but nothing happened once the display has frozen. The only solution was to disconnect power and remove battery. I did that about five or six occasions and kept a visit to the repair centre pending just because of some other engagements. Thereafter, the system used to go into auto shut down when it gets overheated. If I try a start immediately, windows will not start but Kubuntu will start and give some indications on the desktop to say that system temperature is high and all. Win-7 could be started only after a gap of 15 minutes or so when the system had cooled down. Finally one day windows just refused to start. The technician diagnosed the problem to two things -- firstly some cooling pads near the fans had been damaged and needed replacement [a very minor issue] to allow free airflow near the processor for efficient cooling and a permanent damage to the hard disk, which had about 100 GB of very important data. The only solution was to buy a portable hard disk and copy all the data from this one using Kubuntu which was still operational and thereafter, replace both the hard disk and the cooling pads. Thanks to Kubuntu [I think it was 10.04 version I had then], I managed to save the data from the damaged hard discs. Currently that laptop is being used by my daughter who lives separately and the portable hard disk is still with me.

I express my sincere thanks to all those who are involved in the development of Kubuntu.