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    #16
    Re: I click restart and it doesn't restart.

    Originally posted by Zafos
    ....
    I seriously doubt a huge corporation like windows would bother randomly searching for illegal users, unless they are companies and such.
    Oh, you can be sure that Microsoft WON'T bother you... that's what they created the Business Software Alliance for. The BSA is their legal leg breakers.

    .....
    If a hacker sets his mind on hacking ur pc, there is very little u can do to prevent that, if anything. I don't care if u have super special awesome mac OS XXXXXX for which u paid 346723846192$ on, since NASA has been hacked, any1 can. For anything else, there are always awesome av programs, like nod32.
    AV programs can't protect against squat, if the vaccine for a particular exploit is not in the AV dat file, and vaccines for zero-day exploits are NOT in AV dat files. Any zero-day exploit will be in the wild doing its thing for a while before a specimen is captured and given to an AV security firm for dissection so that its vaccine can be included in the next subscription update. How long is the "while". From days, to months, to years, to never, if Microsoft requires that you upgrade to the latest version of Windows to "fix" a security hole in a previous release, which they have done many for many holes. Those who do not maintain an active AV subscription are guaranteed to be infected.

    As far as a hacker hacking into "ur pc", it depends on if "ur pc" is running Windows or Linux. (I don't know much about Mac, but I suspect that a LOT of the bad press about its vulnerability is FUD from MS.) If you are running Windows all that needs to happen is that your email in-box receives an email with an attachment which your AV subscription, even if it is active, does not detect as being or containing a virus or Trojan. All that has to happen to deceive the AV software is to take an old virus or Trojan and recompile it with some re-arrangements and renaming of variable declarations. The old vaccine signature won't recognize it again. There were over 3 million pieces of malware written for Windows last year. Most were recompiled oldies but Goldies. The bot farm discovered last fall had 4,300,000+ Windows zombies in it. All of them were not running without active AV subscriptions.

    Linux, on the other hand, is NOT infected by an virus or Trojan riding piggyback on an email. That is because a Linux executable has to be a file existing on the HD, and that file has to be a legal script or an ELF binary. Further, that script or binary file has to have the execute permission set FOR THE USER. That's three steps: 1) download and save to HD, 2) set the execute permission bit, 3) run the app. That is why email viruses and Trojans do not work in the Linux ecosystem. Assuming that you keep your physical computer secure, that leaves only remote attacks. Last year, about the same time that the 4 million plus Windows bot farm was discovered, another bot farm was discovered. It contained only 700 Linux zombies, and it took the bad guys over 6 MONTHS to collect that paltry sum, at great risk to themselves. An email being spammed anonymously by a Windows zombie Internet server in bot farm is a relatively safe way to spread an attack vector. But, if you have to manually go knocking on the back ports of a Linux box you have to establish a three step handshake to make a permanent connection, in order to do your dirty work. After that connection is completed you'd better be good and quick in order to plant the backdoor bug and remove traces of your malware and activity from the logs before you start your backdoor as a service. Even then, for those who know to keep rkhunter or chkrootkit running via cron, the break-in will be revealed.

    Why only 700 bots after more than 6 months. Those are all they could find that ran as root or used passwords that dearjohn could crack within a reasonable time. IF NONE of your ports respond to any ACK then the second and third steps needed to make a connection can't complete. And, if your PC AND wireless router are not sending out an echo ping it would take a very sophisticated hacker to even deduce your presence on the web.

    From the things u listed, I only have a permanent address, so I guess I am a good candidate for windows. Not that I don't know many friends who have windows and use their credit cards to buy stuff online for years. Nothing has happened to them ever, if u exclude my friend's(windows user, using credit card online) family having its stuff stolen when they all went for a swim the other day and left them at the beach, but even that almost never happens.
    In just ONE CASE alone, more than 2 million credit card numbers, with associated information, were stolen from Sony's windows servers controlling Playstation activity. And that is just one instance of mass theft of credit card info. KEEP IN MIND that it's not only that YOU have a much greater risk getting your CC info stolen if you are running Windows, it is that your risk is increased IF the vendors you do business with run Windows servers on their Internet websites, as well. That's why I choose my vendors carefully.

    In addition to all that, price of windows isn't that high usually, considering it's a very low percentage of the money u'll spent to buy ur pc. I got my own free copy of windows 7 with my purchase, as a discount. That, coupled with some good freeware that exists even for windows and minus the possible hassle of linux, adds up to windows being the best choice for those who don't want to be illegal as well, sometimes.
    You didn't get Windows free, or even a discount for it, when you bought a PC with Windows installed. You paid MORE for you PC than if you could have bought it without an OS, but that is not possible with Microsoft's monopolistic hold on PC OEMs. I was pricing an Acer A500 tablet with Android Honeycomb and the same tablet with Win7. The Windows version was nearly $200 more expensive. That's 1/3rd the cost of the tablet. My friend's HP with VISTA installed is giving him all sorts of OS problems. He's had to reinstall VISTA twice. He can upgrade to Win7 via the upgrade package for $187, or he can buy the Win7 DVD for $278. That's 30% the price of the HP notebook. Windows ain't free or cheap, even if you use only FOSS software on it.

    I do believe though, it's a damn shame linux isn't at least as commonly used as windows. In the world of computers, not always the best thing is the 1 that survives so to speak. We, humans, have found a way to break the rules of natural selection.
    The market share of Linux is another topic I've been tracking and I've discussed elsewhere. Basically, in Feb of 2009 Steve Ballmer himself presented graphical data on his company's analysis of the desktop market share. Apple Mac was at 10%, Linux was at 12%. Since then, both the Mac and Linux have increased in market share. Combined, I'd estimate them to be between 30-35%. Probably Linux is around 15-18% and the Mac desktop is around the same. But, the desktop market share may be peaking, and the tablet market has made a big dent in the desktop market share. A lot of Joe and Sally sixpack users of Windows and Mac desktops have found the Android and OSX on Tablets easier to use. Thus, the Linux desktop share is slowly growing while Microsoft's is going the other way. There is a serious move in the Enterprise ecosystem to move in house client-server apps to web based apps. You don't need expensive Windows desktop computers to run them, but you do need standard keyboards. I've seen data entry clerks sustaining 100-120 cps entering data into apps. One had 4 tabs of text boxes with a total of over 60 controls, and they'd polish off one data set in under 15 seconds and the keyboard buffer could be a form or two behind the clerk. Their fingers were as fast as machine guns, and I often joked that they should register their fingers with the BTF.
    "A nation that is afraid to let its people judge the truth and falsehood in an open market is a nation that is afraid of its people.”
    – John F. Kennedy, February 26, 1962.

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      #17
      Re: I click restart and it doesn't restart.

      Oh, you can be sure that Microsoft WON'T bother you... that's what they created the Business Software Alliance for. The BSA is their legal leg breakers.
      Same thing. I seriously doubt a huge corporation like BSA would bother randomly searching for illegal users, unless they are companies and such. Especially in greece.

      AV programs can't protect against squat......If you are running Windows all that needs to happen is that your email in-box receives an email with an attachment which your AV subscription, even if it is active, does not detect as being or containing a virus or Trojan........
      ......it would take a very sophisticated hacker to even deduce your presence on the web.
      Afaik u need to open the email attachment. I wouldn't be so stupid to do that. I never even open spam. Even if the mail gets past the spam filter, everything else is mail from ppl and services I know of. It would be nearly impossible for me to open an attachment just like that. I also know that u can disguise an attachment, as a word file for example, with a very easy icon and name change. Even if the mail is from some1 I know, I am very aware of who would send me an attachment, y and what it would be. Everything remotely fishy would be immediately noticed.

      Nevertheless, my pc can surely be hacked if some1 sets their mind on it. It doesn't depend on whether I have windows or linux, everything can be hacked. Maybe it would be harder with linux, but still very possible. Of course, I'm not going to think about what OS I'm going to use with this scenario in mind anyway. For example, If u c the statistics of car and bike crashes in greece, they are high enough for me not to drive at all. But I won't base my life in stats and live in fear.

      So, excluding that scenario, I find it hard to believe windows are not enough. I don't think I will ever fall victim to hack attempt of a wide scale, cause these are usually weak enough, for some1 who knows his stuff more or less to be protected. In all these years I we've been using windows I and all the ppl I know and all the ppl they know never had any problems. Unless some of them used a crappy av program, or not 1 at all...

      In just ONE CASE alone, more than 2 million credit card numbers, with associated information, were stolen from Sony's windows servers controlling Playstation activity. And that is just one instance of mass theft of credit card info. KEEP IN MIND that it's not only that YOU have a much greater risk getting your CC info stolen if you are running Windows, it is that your risk is increased IF the vendors you do business with run Windows servers on their Internet websites, as well. That's why I choose my vendors carefully.
      Playstation products have always been hacked very thoroughly. Just like windows, every1 wants to use playstation stuff for free and with the ps3 getting hacked to a point where everything would be free, including psn, it's no surprise to me the psn fell.
      There were already programs for connecting ur hacked ps3 to the psn. Sony countered that with logging all the ppl who used hacked ps3's and baning them all. This of course, along with lawsuits to ps3 hackers, caused the anger of many hackers, who brought down psn. I was expecting that, as I'm sure many others from the ps3 scene did.

      No matter what kind of software sony used, psn was destined to fall, from the moment everything was hacked already to such an extent. Since psn fell, y not take the credit card info as well? Not that I am naive enough to believe that money isn't motive enough, or that there are other examples, but I think that was an unfortunate 1.

      In addition, I'm guessing that mass credit card information thefts are that common for my friends to stop using paypal, for example, via windows and make sure their vendors don't use windows . Again, non of them had a problem for years. I don't know for sure here at all though, cause I'm not using a credit card myself. I will sure let them know of what u are saying. They may very well agree with u, I'm just guessing here.

      All in all, I don't use credit cards, so I don't care :P

      You didn't get Windows free, or even a discount for it, when you bought a PC with Windows installed. You paid MORE for you PC than if you could have bought it without an OS, but that is not possible with Microsoft's monopolistic hold on PC OEMs.....
      Oh w8, I was wrong and right about this. U c, I did get windows for free, but not from there. I bought my whole setup without an os at all. If I'm not mistaken, OEM are complete systems, right? I bought the parts and built the system myself(the store staff actually assembled it, for free(They would also deliver it for free, but there was a part that had only 1 remaining piece of in another store. Apparently, they deliver for free if u order online and that specific part could not be or sth like that, but I digress xD)). U can do that online as well if u wish or by phone, although I visited the store. The staff can also help u build ur system by advising u and they know their stuff too.

      I remembered they gave me sth for free as a discount, because I made a purchase of 2000 euros(including discount). It wasn't windows, but it could very easily be If wanted to buy them. They have dsp and retail versions and home dsp is only 100 euros. I say only, cause compared to 2000 that's only 5%. Especially compared to the 23% tax we have here, this is nothing!

      I downloaded my free copy of windows by downloading it from microsoft, with a password my university provided me with. I also had a copy of windows from a friend's father who didn't want it, but I had already used that on a laptop. U can't use the same copy on 2 pc's right? That man btw, is the 1 who designed, now maintains and is in charge of our national bank's network! 1 of the biggest networks in europe! Pretty cool, huh?

      I just noticed a lot of irrelevant stuff are in these last paragraphs, lol. Sry but once I start talking or typing that's what happens :P

      Windows ain't free or cheap, even if you use only FOSS software on it.
      That's y I said sometimes. Of course u are right about most cases, but I think there are some cases, like mine, where u could get windows for free as a discount or it would be a small percentage of the money u spent on ur system. + FOSS - linux hassle = best choice

      Furthermore, lets not forget we are only talking about legal windows and legal software.

      ...Thus, the Linux desktop share is slowly growing while Microsoft's is going the other way...
      Thank the gods of every religion then I hope a time will come when linux will be the number 1 distributed OS. That's the only reason windows are distributed more, because they are distributed more!! Isn't that a crazy world we live in?

      Comment


        #18
        Re: I click restart and it doesn't restart.

        Originally posted by Zafos
        .....
        Oh w8, I was wrong and right about this. U c, I did get windows for free, but not from there. I bought my whole setup without an os at all. If I'm not mistaken, OEM are complete systems, right? I bought the parts and built the system myself(the store staff actually assembled it, for free(They would also deliver it for free, but there was a part that had only 1 remaining piece of in another store. Apparently, they deliver for free if u order online and that specific part could not be or sth like that, but I digress xD)). U can do that online as well if u wish or by phone, although I visited the store. The staff can also help u build ur system by advising u and they know their stuff too.
        ....
        That's one avenue for an OS-Free PC that I forgot about. The last desktop I owned, eight years ago, was one I built myself. My 70 year old brain is starting to slide ....

        What were we talking about?
        "A nation that is afraid to let its people judge the truth and falsehood in an open market is a nation that is afraid of its people.”
        – John F. Kennedy, February 26, 1962.

        Comment


          #19
          Re: I click restart and it doesn't restart.

          Originally posted by GreyGeek
          What were we talking about?
          Sth about kittens? I like kittens xD Which reminds me, I am allergic to cats, but I still pet them!

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